Gatekeeper Naglfahr

Is Gatekeeper Naglfahr currently a fun boss encounter?
  • Yes
  • No

0 voters

Gatekeeper Naglfahr is currently a pathetic boss encounter in the game.
His spawn position is really bad. He slowly jumps down in a corner and is completely vulnerable during that time. Which is the big reason why the boss encounter’s a total joke.

So I want to suggest what would be a difficulty buff/increase to the encounter in an interesting and hopefully fun way without it demanding much resources.

Let the gatekeeper spawn from behind one of the gates and charge players immediately as it opens. And on top of that, you could have two chaos warrior spawn at the beginning of the fight and during the gatekeeper’s transformation.
Edit: Also consider reducing the transformation time to like 3 or 4 seconds max.
Ideally I imagine the spawn points of the Gatekeeper would be random between one of the two gates and the chaos warriors could be randomized between the points shown in the image below.


I believe these changes would make the encounter much more dangerous than before but without making it under/overwhelming.
The encounter in it’s current state usually lasts between 10 and 40 seconds and there’s not really anything of interest going on because the gatekeeper starts out vulnerable and without anything to back him up.

15 Likes

If only Naglfahr was the only problem on this map… In principle, the whole way to him is a walk in the snow, it usually happens simply NOTHING until the 2nd Tome after you leave the Skittergate. I also doubt that these still marginal changes will change much about the encounter as long as some characters just destroy bosses in seconds…

Nevertheless, this is definitely a good approach for this one boss. But honestly, I just don’t see any more serious changes being implemented in this game, well, atleast in the base game.

1 Like

Can’t tell much about gameplay changes, but one thing is certain.
Gatekeeper would be much more interesting boss, if he could talk.

6 Likes

100% agree Naglfahr is underwhelming.

Just adding CWs seems like a good start.

However a bit of caution to overambitious ideas:
With changing this one, FatShark has to be careful.
I still remember Skittergate was just being skipped every time.
If we would buff this encounter too much, this could revive that method again.
Fighting Deathrattler and Rasknit is challenging for the average player, adding another boss fight beforehand might be overwhelming.

2 Likes

Add a couple of leech spawns to the chaos warriors and it might get interesting or just give us 2 Chaos Spawns instead of the gatekeeper.

The Skarrik fight needs to be buffed too. He needs more HP and maybe a group of plague monks that enter the area BEFORE he does, so he’s not just a sitting duck that can be insta killed by a competent party who have fully charged ults. Maybe a few globadiers standing on the platforms above the area would also help make the fight interesting.

This is a sub boss for a map that’s already hard (and was skipped because of that) and “kinda” long. Buffing the difficulty of that boss could probably prove detrimental to the map as a whole.
The final boss is still “kinda” problematic so can lead to a hard skip as a result.

2 Likes

While true that increasing the difficulty too much would prove detrimental, I think the suggestion I made would make the boss fight more engaging yet easier in difficulty than Skarrik’s fight.
The boss is still squishy and there’s very few additional enemies meaning the fight still wouldn’t need any coördination and would do just fine in random QP games. Not to mention the excessive amount of healing items lying around after beating the gatekeeper.
Deathrattler & Rasknitt are still the map’s highlight and buffing the gatekeeper fight would simply add a bit of fun to what would otherwise be a constant steamroll.

2 Likes

Oh I understand that, but as the map can be lengthy for some, it could be fine if “last boss” does get some health nerf as a “counter balancing point”.
What I mean is that this could have a detrimental result, and that it should be thought out accordingly meaning that if you buff the “middle” event, to make it more fun, and I totally agree that this is kinda boring currently, you have to balance the last event too.

2 Likes

If the last boss ought to get a health nerf it should be rasknitt, the little bastard drags the fight on a bit too long imo. ¯_(ツ)_/¯

5 Likes

Just make the gatekeeper invulnerable during the transformation into a spawn - that’s when he loses most of his health. It’ll be just a guaranteed monster like on Bell or Grain, but with fun comments by Kruber.

4 Likes

Skittergate in general is a very boring map despite the environment/map itself having a lot of potential.

There’s simply not enough going on for like 75% of a skitter run and even the finale is pretty cookie cutter and boring.

4 Likes

As much as buffing him for more fun seems like a good idea i doubt much will come of it as poor ol 'mangler´s been left to be a sandbang for so long.

That and Grail Knight and BH still have not gotten their boss killing nerfed in any shape or form even after both shade and huntsman ate a heap for being too good at it.

1 Like

I wouldn’t mind a slight tweak to the encounter, a small CW escort could do. But I wouldn’t want a complete rework with spawns as other boss fights’. It’s meant as an imbetween encounter in a long map with a terrible ending bossfight.

Also, it would be nice to hear his voice lines again XD they have been aknowledged as missing for months. :stuck_out_tongue:

2 Likes

The question then is whether it might make more sense to eliminate Naglfahr from the game entirely? What does he contribute to the game in its current state? At the moment he is just an obstacle where players can let go of the W key and only need the LMB. #SharkasmOff
I remember a time when Vermintide was hailed as a CHALLENGING COOP experience… it’s a real shame that finding the path of least resistance while chasing red items is so counterproductive to that. (I’m not even sure if it’s the red items at all, since books are already untouched on Legend and this behavior is equally observable on Cataclysm)

I agree, the Deathrattler is in good shape, but Rasknitt can take way too much without his mount for what is still a pretty frail looking wizard. Furthermore, he doesn’t really do much, considering how many spells he could actually have at his disposal, he basically only uses two actively, the teleport and the warp lightning… (the shield while riding on Deathrattler aside)… I don’t know if you can understand the “Vermintide”-spell as such and consider this as an ability in this boss fight.
You could maybe add a little more variety to the game at this point:

  • less HP for Rasknitt (Something definitely needs to be changed about the 1 Shot abilities though, especially for ranged weapons)
  • stronger spells instead
  • make enemy spawns independent from Rasknitt’s “stagger status”

But the main problem I see is the reinforcements, they are usually slaughtered by the player while entering the arena currently… so you would have to find ways to lure the player out of the reserve to make the fight more varied:

  • Enemies spawn in much larger numbers where Rasknitt is,
    they are supposed to protect HIM after all
  • You could unload the 3 coils that are in the corners (AoE damage in a certain radius to lure the player out of the corners)
  • Rasknitt could have more random and multiple locations to teleport to. Why not just put him in the middle?
    • With a magical shield that gives him a very high damage resistance against ranged attacks
    • He could also summon a Maelstrom there like Burblespue

Just some ideas, sorry for the little digression to the end event, I just wanted to touch on that.

1 Like

He has had voicelines? O_O

I´ve been playing since like, original beta i think? And i swear i have never heard a word from him O_O

Just the u5 taunting him.

2 Likes

Yeah he had at game release. After a few months they vanished (it was when they added the replies, so they messed something up there).
What you call the U5 taunting him was meant to be their replies to his taunt (which by now i have forgotten, but it was basically “you’ll die now”)

1 Like

I feel like the current gatekeeper encounter could be replaced with a static chaos spawn, spawn point and it would already be more difficulty than what we have.
I guess my biggest problem with the entire encounter is that its kind of pointless in the long run. For most its a free dice for the ending chest roll and for others its an absolute waste of time. Personally I belong in the latter where I think it pads already extremely long and sometimes even boring map more than necessary.

If the dude would for instance appear in one way or a other in the rasknitt encounter I feel like the initial encounter could be something where we weaken him to make the final battle easier or harder. At least that way it would serve a purpose.

1 Like

It contributes lorewise, as it shows a direct transformation of a chaos warrior into a chaos spawn. So there’s no need to remove it.

It is still challenging, we’re just veteran players, so it’s kinda normal. As it is for a Binding of Isaac (or place any roguelike or darksoul like game) veteran to find it somewhat easy after some time.

About the “farm” issue, it’s a bit strange yeah that the lesser difficulties are most rewarding that the most difficults ones :

  • xp being the same mean recruit farms you xp & commendation hats better
  • quests being linked to a hard number means recruits farm your shillings better
  • cataclysm rewards being the same than legends means legends is better for farming red.
    That’s another issue entirely, and it’s not like we didn’t speak about it yet =p
3 Likes

Well, the “issue” with Skittergate and the Gatekeeper is that from story-standpoint he is meant to be unprepared. I would reckon that activating a giant surring gate would drive some attention but in-game the mission is kinda guerilla/stealth. That is why we have large passages where we don’t encounter much enemies and this is also why the Gatekeeper doesn’t have adds. Because they didn’t see this coming. And after the fight when we have been “found out” the pressure actually starts to increase.

Of course, you could just go with throwing away the premise of the story completely as it is already unbelievable (I mean who patrols his homebase thousand miles away from any kind of enemy unless they fear wild-life or have in-camp issues). But overall, you are supposed to get him on his wrong foot.

Giving some rng concerning from where he enters the arena should be possible though. Or maybe he shouldn’t stand still while transforming. Would help already. Or give him a second tentacle (to much work) or immunity against stunning at all.

Honestly, from in-game standpoint it makes sense how they map plays (although it makes up for some anti-climatic gameplay and we could argue that gameplay goes over story). They should just give us the choice in the beginning to non-chalantly march into the enemy camp (and ignore Lohner’s plan). As a result, the mission would be shorter but we would have to fight an on-going stream of enemies and a buffed up Gatekeeper. So basically:

  • Choice 1: Stupid, short and far more difficult
  • Choice 2: Smart, long and kinda anti-climatic.
3 Likes

Gatekeeper is just a “meme fight”… and that’s totally fine! The map already has too many bosses: we don’t need another one. Rather, I would tune down the final, since presents a crazy RNG that can generate endless hordes of shielded SVs and monks. A terrible situation to face in QP, as it requires a specialized and competent team…

… and QP is precisely the main point. As long as a map can be randomly chosen, it must be in line with the others (duration and difficulty).

p.s otherwise make it a special FoW-style map and make it ten times harder than it’s now.

2 Likes
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