You probably already do that when there are just or 4 to choose from.
And on the flipside I prefer the scanning missions. Hab Dreyko is probably my favorite overall mission.
Wait no, I mean, uhhh. Let me spam run assassination missions or something. We all will only do the same things over and over. (Assassinations are booooooooring to me)
Do you really think that a significant number of the people in T1 to T4 want the other mods? Dogs? Snipers? Lights out? I don’t think so.
The people who choose the maps and mods will decide what the quickplayers play, as they did in V2, and the people who pick what they want will play the same maps over and over.
As for the maps themselves, they’re all pretty samey outside of a few outliers, so I don’t think the ability to choose a map will make a ton of difference to the actual game experience.
Last time I played VT2 doing some quick play I got:
Trail of Treachery
The Pit
Dark Omens (ew)
Empire in Flames
And… I think Enchanter’s Lair? I always mix up the Drachenfels maps, I haven’t done them much overall.
Yet if you believe the fear mongering in these topics you never get anything other than Screaming Bell.
EDIT: Some of the current lobbies open, as of right now:
Or just legend:
Not really seeing a trend here. If anything I see more of the maps people tend to claim are played less. (EG: Boss maps)
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Same experience - had a group of pals last night, running Hi5STGs. Just as we get done with 3-4 runs and start having the most fun - BOOM, vent purge!
The universal reaction was booing and disappointment. This is unacceptable.
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Of course you’re not seeing a trend, that’s a snapshot. Note down the list every day for a month and you’ll see the same 6-7 maps over and over.
You’re also ignoring that DT has mutators, all of which are undeniably better experienced on certain kinds of maps. If people want to play those conditions which are actually fun, they’ll pick the maps that they’re fun to play on. And they will, because the mutators are where you actually get the ability to play what you want since the maps here are mostly identical.
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Have you considered that you might be wrong and that it is nowhere near as “focused on just a few missions” as you and a few others like to claim?
You seem to have a pretty narrow view point that seems to be mostly limited to your own perspective.
I’ve brought it up before (probably on Reddit rather than here) in various formats, but the option to select modifier would be a good start without spreading things too thin. Quickplay with no preference / Low Intensity / no modifier / High Intensity (STG?) / weekly* modifier, I don’t think it would require a significant overhaul of the mission board, but it’d be a step in the right direction IMO.
*Or random modifier from the available pool
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No, because I’m not wrong. One thing that’s remained constant between the mid 90’s and now is that people who play online games want to play them with other people. That means that people naturally gravitate to whatever option has the highest population density, whether that’s a particular gamemode/mutator, map, or even the game itself.
It’s why systems like QP and DT’s map system even exist; If the game doesn’t choose what most people play, most people will focus all their attention on a small set of content, mostly ignore the rest, and the few people who want to play that other content just quit because they can’t reliably find anyone to play it with.
You shouldn’t mistake any of what I’ve been saying as me not wanting the ability to select, by the way. I hate the way modern games try to force us to play things we don’t want to play. I’m just being realistic about it because I’ve lived the alternative first hand and know what it entails.
(I’m amused I checked within a few minutes of you replying despite not looking at the forums today)
Of course you’re not seeing a trend, that’s a snapshot. Note down the list every day for a month and you’ll see the same 6-7 maps over and over.
I mean yes, there’s generally going to be communal favorites on the whole. That’s just… how it goes. It’s a problem if that’s all that gets played, but that’s never been my experience with VT. A higher chance of some of them? Eh, sure, not saying that’s not a thing at all. My point being that saying that no selection due to fear of them just playing only the same maps over and over is asinine. Also 6-7 is pretty damn solid variety considering the game only had 13 base game missions and most others are paid DLC.
At absolute worst you can just host the mission yourself. I have not experienced people leaving solely over the mission I’ve picked when it comes to quick play. (Unless you assume that anyone joining and immediately leaving is leaving over the map, which is also a bad assumption to make, the number of people who don’t realize you can matchmake only into groups with your character available is way too high for example)
You’re also ignoring that DT has mutators, all of which are undeniably better experienced on certain kinds of maps.
“Undeniably better experienced.” Considering I’m sitting here a bit lost as to what exactly you’re referring to, not really? The only thing I can think of is maps that suck with certain modifiers, and that’s generally only parts of them and partially influenced by enemy design. (First thing that comes to mind being Hab Dreyko with sniper squads, or beginning/end of Silo)
That means that people naturally gravitate to whatever option has the highest population density, whether that’s a particular gamemode/mutator, map, or even the game itself.
That’s a vast oversimplification. There’s a lot more factors in play, including difficulty, progression mechanics (or lack thereof), aforementioned modifiers, classes (or lack thereof), etc.
and the few people who want to play that other content just quit because they can’t reliably find anyone to play it with.
As compared to people quitting because they can’t play the content they want to at all?
You shouldn’t mistake any of what I’ve been saying as me not wanting the ability to select, by the way. I hate the way modern games try to force us to play things we don’t want to play. I’m just being realistic about it because I’ve lived the alternative first hand and know what it entails.
And as we can clearly see, Vermintide is completely dead with its… 27 maps now? Which is still usually more available variety than we get on the mission board at any given moment, and then some. That’s not even counting Chaos Wastes or weaves (lolweaves).
As I’ve said, the attraction is the mutators, not the missions. The missions are all a variation of the same 3 or 4 maps and outside of particular events, the missions on a map are almost identical.
You covered an example of why some are “undeniably better experienced” immediately after saying you don’t get it. There’s just some mods that most people seem to hate. I think I’ve seen maybe 2 people say they like dogs or snipers. Most people seem to prefer not to play those which reduce visibility. The only ones I’ve seen people say they really like is hi-int, STG or both. Additionally, some mods dramatically increase the odds of a wipe in some of those particular events I mentioned earlier.
If people are picking a mod to play, they’re going to play them on the maps they work best with. Why do you think V2’s deeds were all locked to specific maps? So people wouldn’t pick a deed and then play it on the map that works best with it.
No it isn’t. All the factors you mention (and more) contribute to particular options becoming popular, but people gravitating to popular things is normal.
Exactly. Lolweaves. The unpopular option is left to rot while everyone plays the popular ones.
They’re another factor. It’s not like I’m going to totally ignore the map, especially if I could actually have options. Right now they get ignored because the incredibly limited choice of 3 maps (generally 2, since one option is just a default difficulty) usually means if a modifier I’m interested in is up, I go for that, since the other option is low intensity 99% of the time which makes me want to close the game.
You covered an example of why some are “undeniably better experienced” immediately after saying you don’t get it.
I was referring to you saying they’re better on particular maps. Barring a few spots on a few maps with very particular modifiers (and there’s no guarantee you’ll even get that situation on that part of the map), modifiers feel largely the same on various maps.
There’s just some mods that most people seem to hate. I think I’ve seen maybe 2 people say they like dogs or snipers.
Because both dogs and snipers have plenty of current issues, mostly related to the servers/netcode being terrible. (Though hunting pack is also poorly implemented in the first place, it largely amounts to sitting in a doorway and slapping the dogs as they rush through)
Most people seem to prefer not to play those which reduce visibility.
Similar issue. Being more reliant on a single light source from a weapon special, which two classes effectively don’t have (barring Gunpsykers which a lot of people don’t like, and ogryn just don’t have one for… reasons) and it requiring you to use weapons you might not like is poorly designed. There’s plenty of other options, from finding light sources/batteries in the level itself to power up your default light source, a general increase on your base light source, tying it to some kinetic charging BS where meleeing enemies increases your light’s radius, etc.
Fog is just kinda boring but I don’t hate it, personally. If high intensity fog is an option, sure, why not? Mixes things up. Sort of. In a lot of places the fog doesn’t even come into play.
If people are picking a mod to play, they’re going to play them on the maps they work best with. Why do you think V2’s deeds were all locked to specific maps? So people wouldn’t pick a deed and then play it on the map that works best with it.
…To help differentiate the various deeds? This goes right back to the aforementioned bit about map variety. Yeah, there’ll probably be ones that get favored over others, but simply allowing a choice isn’t going to equal the only choices becoming certain ones.
Exactly. Lolweaves. The unpopular option is left to rot while everyone plays the popular ones.
I mean also because they have other design issues like being effectively there for a leaderboard in a game where people aren’t playing for leaderboards, a separate progression system, no bots, incredibly limited matchmaking options (AKA none), etc. Claiming the ‘unpopular option is left to rot’ when the mode is just genuinely not very good (along with the aforementioned other problems) is disingenuous.
Particular types of map, to be more specific. Generally speaking, maps with more wide open spaces are more intensely affected by most mods. Dogmode is the only one that gets easier on those maps. I guess low-int does as well, but that’s a space filler mod so it’s not really worth discussing.
The reason isn’t relevant. People prefer the alternatives, so they won’t play those if given the choice.
Anyway, all this is getting way off track. My original statement was that the more choices you give people, the more centralised the playerbase will become, and I stand by that.
The existence of the QP button means there will always be cases of the game selecting your map/mission for you and creating RNG-based diversity, but if there’s enough people setting up games using certain mods on certain maps (and there will be, given the situation around mod preferences), even that will be diminished.
I’ve played whatever is available. Ventilation, Power outage, Sniper, HI, Hunting grounds, Shockt Tropp, etc.
I like all of them except Hunting Grounds; that one boils down to “Get to chock point and spam melee at entrance.”
Honestly I don’t get the craze over Shock Trooper.
Seems like people who can’t stand playing anything else, just don’t like the game anymore. They talk about difficulty and all but at the same time the people commonly hate Elite Resistance.
To be fair, Elite Resistance reduces the number of spawns IIRC (in favour of tougher enemies) - even if the difficulty is increased, making enemies into bullet sponges and reducing the intensity is very different gameplay-wise from the AI director throwing everything at you.
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You know what is even worse? As Fatshark adds more and more silly or boring modifiers, your chances of playing you actually WANT get even smaller. I’m currently taking a break from the game, it must be like 6 week now, and I don’t see a reason to return due to poor fps performance, some terrible game systems and sporadic meaningful content drops. Plenty of other games around, also Battlebit dropped recently which turned into a suprise hit for me and 1000s of others. See you in five (months).
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That’s because Elite Resistance isn’t hard on its own. It’s just low int for the difficulty above you.
Now, ER + STG or Hi Int. Those, I think would be a challenge.
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