You can yet now.
But flamer should not be your main weapon… Your main tool is the melee weapon as zealot
Lets say want to play the Zealot primarily using the Flamethrower. I find it fun, I enjoy it. Why should I not be able to do that? Lore? Who gives a damn about 40k’s lore, it’s backffground fluff and I don’t care about it. So ignoring lore, why can’t I primary a flamer? Why shouldn’t that be viable in every difficulty if i want to do it?
Because let me let you in on a tip of game development… it’s a good idea to offer as many playstyles, mechanics, and variety of choice to your players as possible rather than going “Ok, you want to use that weapon, sure… but we prefer you not to.” That tends to drive people away especially when the reason is as aribitrary and pointless as;
“You should be using melee as Zealot, not ranged!”
Also… ranged is still the better option on Zealot, their only good melee weapon that performs to the par of Psyker and Veteran being the combat axe which both of them can use anyways lol. Auto Shredder VASTLY outstripped the flamethrower before these nerfs. The Agripinaa Braced made the flamethrower a JOKE before. As did the Kantreal. All this nerfing did was delete an entire playstyle from the game.
Unless you want to go psyker I guess, you can still have a now superiro in every regard flamthrower.
If you pick them it´s more for bosses i guess, unless they´re available on autoguns. But if i remember correctly, it´s about lasguns right?
I mean, they actually nerfed it in a bunch of aspects. Let´s check out how it goes before we judge completely about it.
Ofc but still it´s just flak-armored enemies.
Maybe some blessings need a light buff then, but that´s something we´ll see after trying and giving FS data.
You can still use flamer for horde clear if you enjoy it so much, you can’t kill rooms full of reapers crushers etc in 3seconds anymore though. Stop crying, it was overpowered and got a well deserved nerf
I agree shredder also needs a nerf, however it can’t delete a room full of elites in half a clip and runs into ammo issues, which wasn’t the case with flamer
Evi will not cleave with heavy shredd atack through gunners/shotgunners/snipers etc. It means you can control your damage and fully deal it finaly, it is a minor but a buff.
You can still use flamer for horde clear if you enjoy it so much, you can’t kill rooms full of reapers crushers etc in 3seconds anymore though. Stop crying, it was overpowered and got a well deserved nerf
Overpowered, how? Have you tried it in Heresy, Damnation? It didn’t keep up to the Agripinaa Braced, Kantrael, or the Auto Shredder. Are you not calling for THOSE NERFS TOO? What about the Bolter? All of which were better for a zealot to take than the Flamer, and now there’s NO REASON to take the flamethrower. Did you not see the fuel tank reduction? That is CRIPPLING for horde clearing. The damage nerf… while completely stupid and unecessary, as they should focus on making the content FUN rather than nerfing and making guns worse to discourage people from using them… but the ammo reduction on a flamethrower is ridiculous.
If fat shark was PURELY BALANICNG FOR MALICE this MIGHT have made sense, but even then, just make the content more engaging, mroe fun, introduce an enemy with massive burn resistance instead of killing the weapon.
Have you ever seen what happens to these PVE games when they start nerfing weapons into the ground to discourage players from ever even thinking of taking them? Look at Warframes’ population numbers after their nerf patches. They literally have at times lost 70% of their player base until they completely undid their nerfs.
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You know what! Encourage Fatshark to keep punishing players for playing the game the way they want to. See what will happen to it in the long term.
You can’t, it takes ~2, but you can with light shredd. Well not a big deal in terms of a sniper killing, but if he will be around poxwalkers you can just use heavy shredd now.
Not going to lie, I feel extremely vindicated about this.
I kept telling people in the flamer threads that hyperboling it’s effectiveness that much and calling foul at the time would see the thing “deleted” from the meta.
I kept telling people it would get hit with the nerfbat this hard, that it would no longer be viable at all in the harder difficulties.
Well, if you make a mountain out of a molehill constantly, the construction team will eventually get professional drilling equipment for the job instead of a shovel. Who’d have guessed?
Will the community learn from this and in the future see and present things in a more nuanced light? Probably not.
My take: What flamer would have needed was a slight range nerf and maybe a slight ammo nerf. Or a slight damage and range nerf. It got a heavy ammo and a heavy damage nerf, in my opinion the worst of the possible options. Oh well. Not my problem. I never used the thing.
This isn’t a buff. I could do this EASILY before. How? The specials are all larger than the horde, so I can aim at them myself. This is pointless, it’s not a buff it’s just random trash I don’t need that doesn’t let me play the game and have more fun while doing it.
I think it is a great idea to balance weapon to make all weapons having weakness and strong points. Like that, it can incitate players to try several.
It brings diversity in our games.
As ranged weapons you have (i said it before):
infantry autogun: precise and can deal with specials/elite non ogryn. From what I’ve seen, in damnation, they can be useful even for a zealot cause they can deal with ranged (thanks to the bullet per bullet mode) and also can be used in melee (thanks to auto mode)
headhunters: great to deal with ranged threats
revolver: a little weak on damnation, but can be used even here, especially if you put +25% against unarmoured (it can permit to one shot a sniper then)
shotguns: kantrael and lawbringer are great choices
boltgun… nothing to say here, it is a too strong weapon in my opnion
pew pew… MG XII
laspistol (great for critics)
shredder autopistol (great to kill a special in a melee)
braced autogun off course (i prefer the colomnus but lot of people use agri)
For melee:
Hammer: it needs training, but clearly it is not garbage.
Heavy sword: to use with something that can deal with flak / carapace threats. Great at horde cleaning
Tactical axe: fast, versatile. Surprising. You can use with critic template… or use it without (but then headtaker is a good choice)
Combat blade: can be great… but focused on critic template (not my favorite template tbh)
chainsword / chainaxe: did not invest time to test them…
eviscerator: Attack chain is garbage… just my opinion, several players do great things with it.
What I would not say it is good it is:
crusher: did not test… seems to be good at crow control, but bad at eliminating any threat
swords: we have heavy swords… so did not test that
I would suggest less precision at long range… and that’s all.
For zealot I would not use Agri shotgun. But tried it on veteran and… well I must admit in a vent purge + snipers gauntlet condition (damnation) it was so great. I would not use that for zealot, just cause you need a weapon that can eliminate a threat fast and return to melee. Agri is not this kind of weapon.
Kantrael… well this is my actual favorite weapon. The special bullet is maybe a little too powerful. The shotgun itself is… too great for a zealot.
As veteran, I want to test same with the cleaving blessing (that would not work on zealot).
Lawbringer… great shotgun. More versatile than the kantrael. It can deal with long range threats.
I use the colomnus…
Shredder is great, but you have to pay attention to not use it too much or you will impact badly the ammo supplies of the team.
Cause there would be no difficulty at all.
Yeah… you take the bolter… you want to use what you call meta weapons, and did not try other weapons. In other words, you cannot appreciate if a nerf is needed cause you cannot compare with other weapons.
And you always speak about ranged weapons when talking about zealot.
Again… a zealot is a melee class.
Tbh, I did also this error when I started to play damnation. But once you start to play your class, you can begin to progress.
You should use your melee weapon (as zealot) 90% of the time…
FINAL WORD (until this evening)
I will test it this evening and check if they have gone too far. From what I’ve read, I don’t think. But I would not have impacted ammo. I fear the worst about that with players that will continue to use the flamer 90% of the time and will impact severly the ammo supplies of the team.
Yeah, with lights, and good if there is no trashmobs between you and shotgunner. But heavies were unpredictable before, they were acting differently depending on how many stacks of your blessings/feats are active. Anyway it all need a proper testing first.
So the ENTIRE game has to be NOTHING but Kantrael, Agripinaa, and Auto Shredder. Sometimes the boltgun. This is FUN to you? Punishing players from picking other weapons and playstyles? Because ALL OF THOSE were better than the flamethrower, they completely outperformed it by leagues in Heresy and Damnation and you have NEVER played Damnation if you think otherwise lol. Even on zealot those guns outperformed COMPLETELY.
This is punishing players for playing the game outside of the meta.
My MAIN WAS VETERAN. I stated that. I have used EVERY autogun, almost all the lasguns (Hellbore I think is garbage and not fun), I’ve used the Auto Shredder on Zealot when I need to carry a team.
The Meta was NEVER the flamethrower past Malice. It wasn’t even close to the meta, not even NEAR the Auto Shredder or Agripinaa Braced etc. You are high if you think otherwise, the flamethrower wasn’te ven staggering most things in the current state so you could get smacked around for using it even. Instead of just melting things in your way (pun intended) you were relying on a DOT.
It is a different playstyle compared to anything else other than Purge, and relied on DOTS. They have completely killed that playstyle for Zealot.
Again… a zealot is a melee class.
This is such a stupid statement. The zealot STILL PERFORMS BEST with ranged weapons! Agripinaa Braced, Auto Shredder, Kantreal. That is LEAGUES better than any thunder hammer or maul, and equal to the combat axe more or less.
And if people want to play the zealot as a ranged class… LET THEM. You will please MORE PLAYERS and people letting them do that, than going “but… the LORE!”
Who cares about 40ks lore. You think 90% of the market out there has even touched a codex or know the differences of 5th and 6th? No, they’re gamers. They want to have fun, and be able to tackle challenges as many ways as they can or it get BORING and overplayed. Forcing people to the same 2 autoguns, 4 lasguns, the autoshredder pistol… that is NOT GIVING PEOPLE OPTIONS.
And the shotguns are pretty damn meh if you think otherwise I don’t know what to tell you, they’re trash compared to the Auto Shredder.
Well i was saying about evi (scerator), cause he mention that he stuck with combat axe on zealot. Evi can’t kill sniper with 1 heavy, even if some buffs are active.
I use the eviscerator as much as possible, as I enjoy it and its neat… its okay too for horde, but yeah the combat axe is so much better and I get forced into it when playing Damnation of course.
