This attack has less damage than their overhead, 96 dmg on cataclysm (overhead is 150). Except it’s incredibly faster. But that’s fine, I’m not here to complain of the damage or the speed. The problem is that this attack has higher stagger resistance than the overhead. I tested this on unchained with flaming flail. It takes 4 stacks of unstable strength and enhanced power to stagger them out of their overhead. With 5 stacks, 20% power vs chaos, 10% power vs armor and opportunist, I was not able to stagger them out of the uppercut. Which makes absolutely zero sense. As a matter of fact, their kicks and pushes also share this godly stagger resistance afaik (though not their punch or their shoulder shove). What’s perhaps more concerning: getting hit by this attack with unchained when on high overcharge makes you instantly blow up. This doesn’t happen with the overhead, she doesn’t normally blow up from just one attack no matter the damage of the attack. This makes me think the attack is bugged. Either that or there’s really some design desision behind making this attack a big middle finger to unchained players.
Cant that attack deal multiple instances of damage? Or at least hitbox check several times? It might be something along those lines that messes with UC passive.
Something like that yes. Which is why it sometimes does 96 damage and 150 on other occasions.
It also procs Bardin’s gnomril armour and DO damage. It definently counts twice.
The attack is bugged and hits twice.
Adding on top of what was already said, iirc the scoop is not a proper attack but a unique way of “shoving” the CWs have, hence why it cannot be staggered.
That’s not a problem. It is most likely intended since the uppercut is only done by CWs when they ‘break out of being staggered’. CWs do not perform this attack on their own. They only use it when they have been staggered continously before, by multiple shield bashes in a row for instance.
I like this attack because it forces you to stay aware even while staggering which normally renders every other mob defenseless.
But guaranteed stagger like the billhook special can definitely stagger them out of that (as well as the uppercut)
Are you really sure it’s a reaction to being staggered? I’m almost certain I’ve seen CWs do this move even without being staggered before at all. Maybe it’s more that it is simply more likely that this attack comes after staggering CWs instead of another attack simply because their other attacks get staggered and this one doesn’t. I got a feeling triggering this attack is more proximity based, like their shoves. You might well be right, though. I’m not 100% certain at all. Just wondering if somebody ever properly proved this one way or the other.
But yeah, this attack is definitely wonky in that it hits twice sometimes. It can pass through Gromril and explode Unchained instantly, and I even think it can ignore Zealot’s passive as well.
I am pretty dang sure this is incorrect,i think all it takes to trigger the attack is standing close enough and its a tossup between this one, the punch and the butt of the axe.
I’m fairly certain as well that at least one trigger is proximity based. I think the kick is also an option.
Seems like the best fix would be to make sure that the only time a CW ever uses this attack is after it’s been staggered + the player is still close to it. That punishes the player for being carelessly overzealous and gives the CW a way of getting out of being stagger-locked, without the attack feeling uncalled for, random or unfair. Also fix the double damage bug ofc.
Honestly the double hit bug is the only thing that bothers me. Besides that admittedly glaring issue I feel like it’s a pretty fair and good move for them to have to stop them getting bullied too easily. Definitely feels like it’s something that only happens when you’re very close to them.
It is. Or at least intention behind it’s coding is questionable at the best.
This attack is known for ignoring IB’s passive, Zealot’s Passive (killing people straight up through them) and other defensive abilities.
Overall this attack is really strong. It’s quick, relatively unpredictable, hits hard (especially on HFBS deed) and I don’t think you can stagger CW while they’re doing this attack, but it has been a long time since I’ve tested it on Cata so not sure.
I wouldn’t change it though. Maybe make it more staggerable? Or give it a decent cooldown? Because sometimes CW’s can almost spam it.
If its damage profile gets un-bugged it would actually be fine. Having CWs be dangerous is a goid thing, and outside of its damage it isn’t too unfair at all.
Yes, I am sure. I hopped into modded once to prove that uppercuts hit twice proc’ing Gromril Armour first and then inflicting damage. Uploaded the clip to a beta section of this forum like a year ago. At first, I couldn’t even get the CW to do the uppercut until I learned that I have to stagger him first. Go ahead and make a video to prove me wrong. Being too close to a CW without staggering only made him use his push (ie. kick).
Thanks for the info. I knew about uppercuts hitting twice, but I honestly didn’t know for sure how they get triggered. Good to know.
Freshly recorded, this one goes out to all the doubters.
Right. So what probably ends up happening in the real game is that some guy behind staggers him and you get scooped like a champ.
That CWs only make that attack when they are permanently stunned is not a justification. They already have kicks and punches to break free themself.
Also, even if I accepted the “motivation behind” this choice, the realization would remain really bad: very often I can see a CW using that attack even a second after being stunned.
For example, already on the FIRST shields’ bash (after a push), while I’m still performing it, it’s not at all rare that the CW immediately uses that attack… which is so fast that it hits me during the bash animation and therefore I can not defend myself.
You can get the ability to stunlock A SINGLE CW only using a couple of careers…
and it requires an incredible investment (practically never worthing). While it’s still IMPOSSIBLE to stun a bunch of them (for example, with bash, you can stagger only the CW you hit with the central high-stagger zone… wich can hit one only enemy).
Seems like a perfectly legitimate niche to me… especially if we add that CWs would still have kicks and punches to free themself.
And anyway, an attack so fast and with so much damage, is wrong on many levels… a mate can trigger the attack by stunning the CW… then I approach by chance it and take the damage in full, so suddenly (I know, it’s a co-op game and you need cooperation, but we all know it’s impossible to always play with a team of friend with headphones).