Are we all using the same weapon here? People keep mentioning a downward swing on light 2, but for me that downward swing is only accessible after a push attack, and they say it is bad, but it does more damage across the board than the other light attacks (with less cleave.) And the light string is all horde oriented (horizontal, cleave attacks.) Heavies are also slightly stronger than 1h hammer and can 1 shot a marauder more easily.
I like the feel of them in general, though heavies 2 and 3 feel like they should have a lot more weight (cleave) to them than they do. I was expecting them to work like a horizontal 2h hammer swing, but they get stuck on enemies really quickly.
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Okay, got all the DLC weapons open finally, so I could finally also test them seriously. And because I had another eason to test something on Ironbreaker, I picked the Dual Hammers up first.
I built my pair for attack speed, as my initial impression was a bit clumsy feeling (and because itās generally a good build if you donāt have breakpoints in mind). The 10% from weapon and Trinket do a big difference to the feel, and Swift Slaying adds to that. Damage-wide, theyāre, well, strong enough. Heavy attacks can deal with armor reasonably, even one-hitting SVs on headshot. Light attacks also deal enough damage to not feel like just pushing enemies around, even if they donāt kill immediately. Cleave and stagger give enough control to keep enemies at bay, at least with the speed bonuses.
The only thing I had trouble with was the push attack, and specifically the use for it - and its unique follow-up. As you canāt really use the push-attack to create extra space with its single-target nature, and as the heavies are there to deal with armor, I canāt really find a good purpose for it. It also has a unique follow-up light, an overhead strike not accessible elsewhere in the pattern, which suffers from the same problem. I suspect they are meant to be precision attacks, to be used for headshots, but that rarely has merit on its own. Also, heavies do that easily enough (and harder), and a unique follow-up is a mechanic not seen on any other weapon, so it can even be kind of hard to find.
The hammers donāt really end up competing with Dual Axes in any way, and not particularly complementing them either. As someone mentioned, they occupy a similar niche to the one-handed Hammer, being a mobile crowd-control weapon. They have enough difference in their use to warrant both, though; Dual Hammers are a direct approach weapon with simple patterns, while single Hammer depends even more on its mobility and somewhat more complex attack pattern.
I canāt give any particular suggestions, and I feel theyāre mostly in a good spot, but the push attack (and again, its follow-up) could use a bit more definition for their purpose. Of course, damage and stagger amounts may need some tweaking, and I wouldnāt see lowering damage and enhancing stagger a bit as a bad thing, but Iām not convinced itās needed.
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itās good against normal weak rats, but takes too much time and effort to damage armored enemies like chaos warriors or strmvermins
When you need to create space in a horde, you donāt need to do the follow up attack after the push, click (donāt hold) and go back to light attacks and there is no single target attack involved.
I know that perfectly well. Actually, in VT1 most weapons didnāt have a push-attack. Iirc, only Kerillianās dual weapons and the one-handed Axe had one.
That said, I think every attack on a weapon should have a use, and for the Dual Hammer push-attack(s) itās hard to find. I have similar gripes about Halberd and maybe some other weapons; there are attacks that are hardly used, so why are the attacks there, then?
Is the push attack armor piercing?
Yes, deals ~20 dmg or so to armored on headshot, ~9 on body. The main use Iāve found for it is sneaking in a hit or two on stormvermin in mixed hordes, because you might not have the space to get a heavy attack out.
As IB I mainly use push attack when ult is on, to eliminate stovermin from my surroundings without exposing myself to hits too much and also just when fighting horde/patrol against annoying enemies with shields. Works fine with 1h axe, so I guess it would work even better with 2 hammers.
I find the push attack followed up by the light overhead is good for shielded enemies. Pushattack + light overhead will usually kill shield marauders. Shieldvermin need a heavy overhead to finish them off after youāve opened them up.
I think the DH are pretty close to where they should be. Maybe just a touch more armour damage on the heavies (and perhaps the push attack) but other than that theyāre in a good place.
I finished off all the achievements for the dual hammers on the weekend and my opinion now is that this is the only one of the new weapons thatās close to a good state (That said, I havenāt tried Kruberās new one yet). Saltz, Kerillian and Siennaās weapons are broken as hell, but thatās for another thread I guess.
Happy to see some changes made to these! Will be testing them out today:
Balance
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Dual hammers:
āThereās nothing like a festive rhyme,
to say itās dual hammer time,
to increase stagger, cleave and range,
also chained light attacks will see some changeā-
( Bumped range across the board.
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Switched diagonal heavies to medium tank profiles, more cleave and stagger.
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Fixed issues with hit stop anims triggering on the āleadingā hand weapon on heavy attacks.
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Increased light chain attack speed slightly (like 15%). )
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Sir, i LoL at you.
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