Strain of adding new branches?

[Heretical_Cactus]

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Currently each branch on every tree is on average able to access to the keystone in 20 talent points.

If they add new branches, they could keep that number as target, but there would be the problem of increasing the number of points that could be wasted by travelling from 1 side of the tree to another, more so if they were to add a 5th branch (to keep the symmetry), making it possible to waste 4 points

This could either be accepted by the community, as being able to cross the whole tree while being nice isn’t something that necessarily fall under common sense.

This though might have to either be expressed to the community while they’re applying their perks, or could be made impossible by locking different branches when going into them. This is something that already exist (Ogryn Ability to Aura)

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There is also the matter that they’ve currently settled on 3 branches, so the door on such content isn’t closed just yet.

@FatsharkCatfish

Currently we settled in on a three blitz, three combat ability and three keystone configuration per talent tree, with a varied assortment of talents and stat nodes

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Why add new branches/classes

Because adding new archetypes is more unlikely to happen multiple times, more work intensive, and would be quite stupid to introduce concept that are close to the currently available ones, like new Psyker themed on other discipline.

And at the same time be able to have the new expansions be able to interact with the current systems, foremost for ones that are thematically able to be introduce within the current sets (Stormtrooper Veteran; various Psyker; Enforcer/Crusader Zealot…)

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Comparison between new branch/class and Archetypes

Voice actors/lines:

Each archetype has 3 or 6 voice actors, each voice actors has currently 3,800 voice lines (with the note that new updates often bring new voice lines).
But a branch would just add new voice lines, for the new ability and blitz.

Weapons:

No new weapon “needed”
While new archetype for the most part should have nearly no shared weapons (Eg: Tech Adept only using)
New branches instead would use the current set of weapons, but would benefit from having a couple of new weapons added at the same time that fit their ‘theme’
Eg: Zealot getting a PSword and Suppression Shield weapon alongside a Crusader branch.

Cosmetics:

Branch/class would not be impacted by the Commodor, but would require new some Penance Cosmetics
On the other hand new archetypes would require new Commodor, Commissary, and Penance cosmetics.
As well as introduce some monetisation problems. Where selling cosmetics for dlc (if the archetype is sold, which might be the wrong choice) was something they were unable to do in VT2.

Hence why they made the Prem Career in separate pack (Career + Cosmetics) on Steam but not on the Microsoft store, as well as gave the following cosmetics for free to Xbox players:
→ Luthor Huss
→ Louen Leoncouer
→ Belegar Ironhammer
(Not sure if SotT recieved one, Necro didn’t 100%)

Penances:

Would mean introducing 1/3 of the Penance amount (Well less, but won’t bother finding the real ratio, would be less)

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Polls

(Ranked choice pool, mostly testing that feature out) Traveling cost

• System remain as is (Increasing the point cost from 2 points to 3-4 per traversal)
• External Traveling nodes are fused (On the extremities, keeping it at 3)
• Looping nodes (On the extremities, letting you go from 1 end to the other)
• Traveling nodes are fused (1 central node at each area)
• Branch locks (Furthest Branches get locked)
• Other idea

Real polls:

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The traveling cost would be a problem

• Strongly Agree
• Agree
• Don’t care
• Disagree
• Strongly disagree

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The introduction of new branches would require an increase to the total talent points (Currently 30)

• Strongly Agree
• Agree
• Don’t care
• Disagree
• Strongly disagree

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The addition of new branches would be a good thing and worth doing

• Strongly Agree
• Agree
• Don’t care
• Disagree
• Strongly disagree

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Current tree getting 1 or 2 branches would offer more gameplay wise than a new archetype

• Strongly Agree
• Agree
• Don’t care/Equal offer
• Disagree
• Strongly disagree

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[Badwin]

New branches would definitely be less work than a new archetype. And I really like the idea of a slot system – where we always have 3 branches but you can swap them in some limited fashion – that someone suggested when the topic of new branches came up before.

[Reguah]

I like the idea of adding more branches to the current ones just to give us more options, but if I had to choose between adding branches or a new archetype I would choose new archetype.

@Heretical_Cactus

System remain as is (Increasing the point cost from 2 points to 3-4 per traversal) Looping nodes (On the extremities, letting you go from 1 end to the other)

Reason I voted for this is because I want the branches to be unique and distinctive, if you let us travel between branches “freely” they will start to feel very similar.

@Heretical_Cactus

The traveling cost would be a problem

I disagree because of the point I made earlier about the branches will feel the same if you can cross freely.

@Heretical_Cactus

The introduction of new branches would require an increase to the total talent points (Currently 30)

I mean it would be nice to have more talent points, but at the same time there wont be much variety between builds if you have too many points.

@Heretical_Cactus

The addition of new branches would be a good thing and worth doing

I wholeheartedly agree, more choices and new ways to play I’m all for that.

@Heretical_Cactus

Current tree getting 1 or 2 branches would offer more gameplay wise than a new archetype

This I don’t agree with because like you mentioned with a completely new archetype we would get more penances to complete, more great conversations between all characters, hopefully new and interesting weapons unique to that archetype, so gameplay wise I personally would get a whole lot more out of a new archetype then 2 new branches for each current archetypes.

[Reguah]

@Badwin

And I really like the idea of a slot system – where we always have 3 branches but you can swap them in some limited fashion

That’s an interesting idea, I haven’t been reading the forums much so I haven’t seen that suggestion until now, but that’s one way to get rid of the extra travel cost if they added 2 new branches for each archetype.

[Jonn]

@Badwin

where we always have 3 branches but you can swap them in some limited fashion – that someone suggested when the topic of new branches came up before.

@Reguah

That’s an interesting idea, I haven’t been reading the forums much so I haven’t seen that suggestion until now

Remember when Fatshark promised a new class every quarter?

While adding branches to the sides would make the talent tree to bloated, making a feature that could “remove” one of the tree paths and replace it with another in its slot could work, that would however mean that every new path would have to have the same layout in the potential slot it would go in, example they would add three new paths for the left, middle and the right existing paths for each class. That or just keep adding things at the bottom of the tree and give us more points.

That thread felt like such a long time ago, I still kinda hope they go this route.

[Murderer]

Where’s the extra point?

Alternatively this

They don’t have to add a travelling cost. It’s fully optional based on wether they want to or not for balance reasons.

[Heretical_Cactus]

Basically this

If they add a full new branch, and you want to go from the extremes atm you end up with 2 points that are not serving to go deeper.

With the addition of 1 branch, you end up with 3 points, and with 2 you can end up with 4 points in the same horizontal as the one that unlocked the horizontal level.

And sure the Vet has an example of traveling nodes having been fused, bot that’s not for the full tree.

And what you’re showing in the 1st picture is akin to fusing the extremities

[Murderer]

I know they COULD do that, but they also could just not do that. Where is there a problem here? You make it sound like it’s some sort of dilemma. It’s not, they can just fuse the travel node. No problem whatsoever

[Heretical_Cactus]