Someone convince me that focus target is worth taking

Melee buff is good, ranged buff is ok but pretty weapon dependent. My preferred shotty on my melee Vet gets bugger all from it in practice unless I spend even more points down there for the reload nodes at which point I start missing out on quite a bit for it.

Tagging plus the node with attack boost allowed me to reach a breakpoint I couldn’t before, and it doesn’t feel downright bad to play. That’s the most I can do, Playing the new tagging vet somehow feels both worse to play and weaker than my previous support Vet build, and I can’t even put my finger on it.

Honestly, I’d rather run the full nade build, but since elite dmg went to the left side it lost too much damage if you aren’t taking the tagging keystone.

It feels downright horrible to play. Agile Engagement was fine if you just forgot it existed and used it as quick-shot breakpoint at most, but this switching stuff to gain buffs takes the cake for the most horrible keystone enjoyment-wise.

Half of it doesn’t even work, it’s like a joke. You can’t even use it with volley fire it just bugs out lmao.

IDK wtf the testers did again, but none, and I mean none of the other keystones occupied so much mental space and none of them have so much busywork as Vet’s IDK how these got okayed to be enjoyable to play. Not even talking about needing so many points to reach them in the first place.


Your stacks dont go away when the target dies until the buff runs out.
As always this might be intended or a bug, but as it is now its not NEARLY as bad we thought it is

Getting it just for the melee buff, is a great deal for 1 point (if you got there already, which is likely, because of the other melee buffs right above it).

If you want to invest further into that keystone, i agree that you have to give something up.

If FS removed the 3 terrible nodes from the middle branch, it would certainly open up a bunch more possibilities.

Not sure what you are on about.
On high diff, you have a reason to regularly swap between your weapons.
If you would not already, all you have to do for a great melee bonus, is to quickly shoot 1 trashmob and swap back to melee.

If you have an extra skill point, you almost never have to reload your gun.
If you have one more, you have 40% toughness regen on demand. You can even use it to get 20% toughness every 3 seconds, when you are in a pure melee or pure gunfight.

Not sure what part you mean doesn’t work.
Can’t comment on interactions with volleyfire.

I don’t think they take a lot of mental space at all.
They are probably less brain-use intensive, than the psyker keystones.

I agree on this point.
They could remove some bloat. Especially on the bottom middle branch (iirc, 3 completely useless nodes, 2 of which you have to take).

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You just wrote down what feels bad about it. It feels unnatural. Swapping weapons to keep up the melee buff feels bad. You naturally swap when something needs shooting, and suddenly losing dodge/attack speed and dodge distance feels extremely jarring. This goes against the natural flow of switching weapons when the situation demands it.

If you go equip your ranged weapon with volley fire you don’t get the ranged buff, Crit rate boost only applies to the first shot.

I disagree. I actually like the psyker one, even the highlight one that points out that 2-3 last shooters that want to sneak up on you.

When playing psyker, i swap weapons all the time, just to use them regularly.
Swapping weapons on vet, every 10 seconds in order to gain a massive melee buff, seems completely fine to me. You likely will have something to shoot every ~10 seconds anyway, when playing on damnation+. And thanks to the guaranteed crit on first shot, it is quite likely that you can 1-2tap the target (with some of the guns).

Well you do have a buff indicator that shows you how long it lasts.

Well that sucks and is quite clearly a bug.

I would assume that this is intentional.
Just that many of FS’s descriptions are bad and some are flat out wrong.

Ok. You are free to disagree.

Although i do not understand why you would say that (use taking a lot of mental space and busy work) about a keystone that literally only requires you to tag enemies (which you should be doing anyway), to keep a 12% dmg buff active on everyone.

Or about a keystone that applies a buff to the weapon that you just swapped to.

Aside from that, if keystones are to be part of the identity of a build, they are to be somewhat gameplay relevant, no?
So if you have to do slight adjustments to your gameplay, in order to gain full benefit, that woul not be an issue at all to me.

@Flawless don’t be this dense.

Mental space.

Do you know what is similar? Keeping up FotF 20% attack speed boost on Zealot, it has a big payoff of a big kill/chunking horde, minimal cost, and doesn’t force you to switch off melee. It feels great to use! Suddenly slowing down gives the feeling of windedness and the ult is like a second wind.

You know what doesn’t feel good for me? Having to randomly drop AS and dodge speed if I don’t pull my revolver to shoot a damn poxie when the side I’m trying to hold a side of some wierd triple horde spawn in maelstrom when my team fights off a boss and the special wagon in the back. It totally breaks how I play.

When I play a damn melee Vet and rush the elite blobs before being alerted I want to slash them up and not randomly drop a bunch of AS and DS/DD if don’t randomly shoot something. Yes I can shoot the damn shotgunners, but if I’m playing a melee Vet I want to decide when to shoot and when to chop naturally and not by the pressure of keeping up some some damned buff.

Yes, that’s the only one I think actually feels good to play, and some how, in some weird way the whole commissar build feels less enjoyable than before, and I can’t even put my finger on it why…

But I already wrote that down.

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Concept? Eh… its uninspired, but not bad.
Core buff is ok.
Modifiers are definitely bad.

I am actually using this right now with my revolver build and quite like it (I specced no modifiers, so only the keystone itself). The general view of how this should be used is dead wrong by most people imo. I took it because I always tag things. This turns that tagging into a minimum +4% damage bonus, but potential 20% damage bonus. Its something I do anyways, so why not add more value to it? Saving your tags to try and max stacks is the wrong way to utilize this. Just play like normal, and its a free damage buff for you and your teammates.

They should probably change the modifier that increases max stacks to instead decrease max stacks to ~3, but each stack is now worth 10% instead of 4% (would probably need to change values for other modifiers as well).


I like this. Could also just double it from 4% per stack to 8% with 4 stacks so it reduces the charge time from 10 to 8s (or w/e) and gives the same buff it does now.

I also really like the tag because the yellow is more visible than the red, and it’s fantastic for nuking high value targets. It’s hard to pass up +32% damage. Against your average mook it’s w/e. Nice but not always necessary. Against a boss it’s fantastic. And then a 12% buff for all allies after? Icing.

Plus, I personally don’t like the weakspot kill tree (and the keystone looks actually bad,) and the ‘melee and ranged and melee and ranged…’ build is an interesting choice, but not how I want to play Veteran.

Uninspired or not, the WHC “Nuke this target,” tag is a valued and welcome addition to the vet support playstyle.

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The difference is that you’re not swapping weapons because you need them here, you’re swapping them to maintain a buff. That’s why it feels unnatural.

As with many of these cases in DT, the solution to this problem is to ignore the buffs entirely and just use your weapons as normal, with the added bonus of partial buffs gained through normal gameplay. However in this case, that’s a bad idea because doing things like swapping to your gun to reload between fights wipes out your buffs.

No argument that it’s strong and the ways to get the most out of it at fairly clear, but that doesn’t make it feel good to use.


I am serious.
It is very easy to maintain.
I think as soon as you use it for a few matches, it won‘t be a problem at all for you.

Ok then use a different keystone.
This one is great. You just do not personally like it. And that is fine.

Psykers swap weapons or perform certain actions in order to maintain peril and toughness, all the time.
That includes weapon swaps and force sword special activations when they are not necessarily the optimal attack to use (when not considering certain talents that only get triggered because you did it).

This problem is solved by one of the keystone nodes that auto reloads your gun.

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Wait… Do you actually think I haven’t tried it?

Oh, you know what? I gladly take back the patch 14 version of the melee vet, thank you. Now it’s just budget Zealot again.

+12% almost permanent damage buff to all fireteam members
+40% toughness replenishement to all fireteam members on 16 sec cooldown
+4% - 32% damage increase tagged target
An all you have to do is just tag
I don’t understand how you can complain here.
The middle veteran shout branch is the strongest support class in the game.


I’m not going to argue about it, I’m just going to say it that what’s required to manage the buffs from Weapon Specialist feels awkward and clunky. I’ve been running it for the past 4 missions and it’s not feeling any less so.

Perhaps it would if I ran it for the next 10 runs, but honestly I’m not enthused to try that with how it feels. I’d much rather just ignore it and benefit from the less-than-peak effects while I play as normal.

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If we’re going with the keystone as it is, then it must absolutely have something AoE built into it.
Because the relevance of single enemies pretty much fully stops at T3, any further tiers will always have multiples. Auric will have multiples all the way down to monstrosities.

For now this feels like a keystone that PG wielders will take to quickly boost their damage before shooting something big. In a completely non-teamwork way, I must add.

Pretty much this, it should have the tag cap raised to three and have a modifier node that let’s stacks move from one target to another if the original target dies.

It does have aoe. Because with bonus node, it buffs all damage from all teammates to all targets.

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You always have the ability to tag , if you dont have one stack it will do a normal tag.

the core function is retained

there is a six second gap between the last buff falling off and hitting 8 stacks , the buff can only fall off if there is nothing that is taggable to fight for 10 seconds.

i wouldn’t claim to have maxxed its potential but what i was doing was pretty simple. i would tag a crusher or reaper and one shot them with the plasma to get it running and knock off a big boy. if there wasn’t a single high health target id just drop it anything thats going to die fast even used it on jumping pox bursters.

then at the first trigger everyone gets 40% of their sta and tough back and a 12% damage buff.

from that point on im generating a stack every 2 so the team is generating 2.5% sta and tough per second on average and so long as i can tag at least 1 elite/special each 10 seconds. which is not a difficult task.

then when you fight a boss it gives the team a long duration 32% damage buff

if you keep in mind the buffs are team wide those numbers add up pretty big imo.


Not really. It has AoE coherency buff, working in exactly the same manner as your damage aura (should you pick it), somewhat more powerful but conditional. The condition itself is still “kill tagged target”, and in no way related to anything AoE.

In fact, this part doesn’t even synergize with the main part (tag for increased damage) - if you want your teamwide buff running, you’d probably focus on tagging enemies that are easier to kill or about to die anyway. Unless, as I said above, you’re wielding PG and using keystone entirely to get a quick damage boost. In that case you probably can (no guarantees given the size of vet tree) pay 1 more point to also have a teamwide buff along with you killing big targets. But that’s pretty much entirely only for big gun wielders.