There is no worse feeling in this game than being the last 2 standing and seeing your ally is a knife stealth build.
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Tbh I think the root cause of this is penances. Zealots used to run ahead because they were trying to get the sub 20-minute penance by finishing the map as quickly as possible. In fact I had to do that myself by speedrunning a heresy map in 17 minutes by leaving the team in my dust. But later on they made those penances private-game only and the behaviour stopped.
The behaviour came back in a big way after the last update because they added several penances specific to loner and shroudfield that force you to break coherency in order to complete them.
Other than that, the zoomie zealots in maelstrom that run ahead and kill everything are actually doing it right. Maelstrom does not tolerate dawdling, any second spent not killing enemies blocking your path should be spent running towards the finish line.
Nope.
Not the root, but they sure as hell don’t help the situation.
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Same without loner… 
Learn to survive… if you need 4 guys in coherency and can’t suffer to have 1 less, then there is a problem
Loner is fine… vet keystones are not (and I don’t even ask them to change them considering how much time they are in the game).
Loner has, at least, a purpose.
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Yeah, maybe it’s more appealing now that people tried it out because of it? 
I’m just not going to go down the line of blaming everything on a few bad penances. It doesn’t feel rational to me that there are multiple people 1-2 months after the update on the hardest content doing these kinds of tactics for penances.
On the other hand, if it is the case, then the fact that “random” people can do this just to get some penances done without dying or getting into trouble is a problem in and of itself. A much larger problem.
Maybe more pinchpoints with 4-player “group-up” doorways would help fix the loner players a small bit.
Loner itself bad in a state that persist now: u have aura radius and need to leave it to recieve bonus from this aura. Maybe would be good idea to reduse aura radius (prodused and recieved from others to zealot) to 0?
Agreed this is how i use it, flanking gunners and cutting them down before they can shoot at my team (doesnt help them tho apparently) then when im on a different class the same teams wonders why theres so many gunners killing them.
Also the less specials spawing when last alive has helped me get everyone up so many times and i always get praise for it and not having it on makes a very noticable difference to how much bs gets thrown at you when last alive.
You don’t have to leave, you just have to be a little away. And this can happen really fast.
Loner is not an aura you want it to proc, loner is a tool that is here when things go bad (hello the situation where all my team decided to die), when you explore (let’s be honest, 75% of players don’t explore) and also if you are a little away cause someone did not look behind him (happen lot of time)
Loner is not a problem, but players are. I agree that someone that aggro everything and don’t play in coop can be a problem, but this is not loner the problem… This is the player itself.
And about people that explore… I rarely take loner (in fact I don’t pick it, I just want the talents above) but loner or not I would explore and won’t change how I play.
In fact there are players that want to impose the way they play the game to others… That’s wrong.
Thia game has so many frustrations than wanting to impose a gameplay ia really a bad idea.
The only thing that remains in this game is the combats and the fact DT allows so many different way to play the game. So wanting to restrict them is not a good idea.
You said Loner sucks but here is a thing that Loner lets you do…
Okay, so, let me ask you this. Do the two real auras… prevent you from doing these things?
These things you mention smack of rationalizations to me. Things that loner can help with but it isn’t that much better. Like “loner lets you explore more,” really? Don’t be ridiculous, anybody can do that, especially any other zealot build because zealots are already extra fast. Like Ralendil said, Loner totally isn’t that important if you want to explore and scavenge more.
Yes I really hate people who abandon the team in this team game, I wish they would just go play something else if they were this uninterested in co-op games, and I wish Morrow would brand them as deserters and have Sefoni brain burst them, but that didn’t translate directly to concluding that Loner stinks. Like I said, this behavior isn’t unique to zealots.
Really the “clutch” defense is the only one of them I’ll accept, and only because of the ‘fewer disabler specials’ thing, which isn’t even in its description and a lot of players probably don’t even know it does that. In fact I didn’t know it did that until some of you guys said so. Although, as far as I know, the spawning of extra disablers only happens when someone is really separated from the team, like far enough away that they play the “where is everybody” line and then they stay that way for a while, so ducking off to loot a side room or nipping ahead to slit up some shooters general won’t even trigger that even if you don’t have Loner.
“Loner is not the problem” is a poor excuse. It’s like if you designed a commercially available car that can go up to like three hundred miles an hour (I think the average for most regular cars is around 100mph), and was marketed with slogans like “Fast enough to outrun the police.” Then I complained that more people are speeding when they drive this car, you come back with “the car isn’t the problem, people breaking the speed limit is the problem.”
Loner helps people be awful teammates. It’s in the name, it’s in the description, this ability lets you go off on your own and avoid the usual consequences of doing that, and the only ways that it “benefits the team” are indirect or theoretical, and don’t really rely on Loner. If you are using Loner, you are not providing an aura to the team, and you are getting zero benefit out of Loner unless you are away from the team, thus reducing everybody else’s coherency bonus. THAT is why I say Loner is not fine.
This is the important point I’m making here: the zealot’s third aura doesn’t have to be this way. In order to do whatever it is you think you can do with Loner, you don’t need to be a detriment to rest of the group by having Loner as it currently exists. It would be so easy to just make the third aura do something else and have this Clutch Assistance thing that Loner actually does help with be a different skill. It should replace that one talent that reduces spread and recoil on successful dodge, I don’t think anybody cares about that one.
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That is actually a really good talent, that I really like.
wut, ferreal? how, why?
I’m running either bolter or Brauto on Zealot, it’s great for both. Easy to trigger and reduces spread by a lot. It also effects throwing knives.
It’s not doing much (anything) for revolver, but that weapon is immoral imo.
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dance of death is the buff level executioner stance should have. its that good, with all manner of guns. except like 2 shotguns that want to use hipfire (and I guess double barrel when its added). particularly fun with the braced revolver, lasguns and AG1 autogun too (my usual go to’s on zealot besides the las pistol or kantrael shotty).
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I really laughed at this sentence… that’s true. On a veteran, this weapon becomes insane.
Ok. Should I try, learn to survive without a crutch?
There are stupid guys that will go far away with their loner. But not all.
Guess what? there are stupid guys that cannot move enough fast and die cause of this… yesterday, WITHOUT LONER, I had to come back at the start of the carnaval level. The guys succeeded to die at the first floor, all of them, cause they had not followed… I did not rush. I have killed every enemies in this room and just moved forward… they have just taken time, too much time, to follow.
You dislike a talent, but there are players that like it.
There are so many things that can make you a terrible teammates. I will quote several:
- when you don’t loot chests
- when you don’t explore and complain cause we all die (maybe we would have not if we had a medikit?)
- when you take too much time to move forward and generate new spawns, making the mission harder
- when you don’t look behind you cause everybody should be on your side!
etc.
IMO loner aura should look like this:
- U cannot recieve any of others auras buffs in any circumstances.
- U cant recieve help from others.
- U always have coherency 2
- U have ability to free yourself from dogs or net.
- U have 1 wound.
- U can free yourself from post death capture, but u have no tougness and 1 hp. Also u have 120 seconds delay to respawn.
Thats it. U a loner and can do everything by yourself.
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I disagree totally
this is not a solo game… you go far from your teammates… you know you can be trapped or caught by a dog. That’s it and perfectly fine.
Yeah they should take the loner talent, put it in Masozi’s ship, stick a few melta bombs in there and launch that sucker into the sun.
Bloody talent only encourages stupidity.
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oooohhh, okay. I basically never use the bolter cuz it takes such a long time to switch to.