A suggestion to SAVE psycher

Warhammer 40,000: Darktide General Discussion
1

My suggestion to save the psycher.
The psycher doesnt feel much like a psycher, if im going to be real. The feeling starts immediately as soon as you start the game.

The Force sword:
The force sword is just way off … it is a very slappy weapon with almost no impact(Physics) or damage,
Now a force sword is just a sword for damage so it should be in the same damage and physics as the powersword … however generally most psychers get more penetration out of thier force weapons than a standard power weapon. If theres any sword in the game that should operate like the power sword presently does it would be the force sword.

The weapon slots:
So you have a melee and a ranged slot for the psycher, which isn’t the worst but generally psychers have a “Weapon of last resort” they have to either kill themselves if they are about to lose control or to fight enemies very resistant or immune to psychic powers (Deamonhost).

Staffs: In general i think you need to flesh out staffs much more, they should each be committed to a school of Psychic discipline from the warhammer 40k universe each should use right click to block with a psychic barrier that costs perils per hit, and blocks melee and ranged. left clicks should be different and leverage different mechanics based on thier school(detailed below) they should also have a different psychic power on alternate fire ang on the grenade key(telepathy can use brain burst).

You should probably elaborate on the psychic disciplines in 40k to help guide your progress forward with how to expand the psycher. Lets start easy and work our way towards stuff that needs more work.

Telepathy staff:
Left click -(Numb the Senses)
a projectile like the trauma staff that Slows the targets attack and movement speed

Alternate Fire - (6th Sense)
Fairly costly(30%) instantly starts toughness regen for allies in cohesion and reduces toughness damage by 50% for 5ish seconds.

Grenade key - (Brain Burst)
Instant version of Brain Burst sets to 100% perils after Using and scales with staff damage so its still useful in difficulty 5.

F - (Hemmorage)
Inflicts a heavy stun like the lightning staff charged attack in 360 degrees around the psycher, causes bleeding stacks.

PyroKinesis
Leftclick - (SoulFire)
a small flaming projectile that acts the same as current trauma or voidstrike staff but instead of direct damage explodes igniting neighboring enemies in soulfire(2 stacks), and adjacent targets(1stack). Higher level versions of this staff should apply more stacks and have a different bar for how far from the primary target soulfire stacks will jump to help it scale into the late game.

Alternate Fire - (Flame thrower)
operates like the current flamer/flamethrower spell costs perils / second to cause damage over time.

G - (Fireball)
I feel like this doesnt really need an introduction but an area of effect like fully charged current trauma staff or voidstrike charged shot explosion that causes fire damage and soulfire stacks.

F - (Firestorm)
Creates a short temporary fire storm around the caster killing enemies in a 360 degree arc around them. should be very short maybe 3 seconds but kill all non elites within melee range in all directions heavily wounding human sized elites and maybe 1/3 ish to heavy targets.

Unique Mechanic: Right click blocks but it costs more perils and enemies that strike your shield in melee are inflicted with soulfire. Reposte shoots a quick puff of flamethrower like current flame staff left click.

Telekinesis
left click - (Telekinetic Punch)
This left click should inflict some real physics and be able to light stagger up to and including rager/mauler enemies should knock down surviving non elites (think psycher shotgun).

Alternate Fire (psychic rail gun)
Uses a small stone/coin/bullet and hyper accelerates it in the desired direction functioning like a target penetrating ogryn grenade, you should be able to shoot through horde enemies to snipe snipers with this ability. Make it costly like 30% perils so it sis not a sustainable offense situational only.

G-(Gravitic Crush)
Force any smaller than boss/monstrosity to the ground and deal damage over time until killed or the psycher is interrupted or they reach 100% perils. bonus points for making it more perils efficient for heavier and bigger targets and unwieldy to use on normal enemies.

F - Keep the current push but clean up its hitbox(its really wonky presently), maybe allow the player to hold the f key to see the hitbox, instead of reducing perils have it deal strong physics that can knock down ogryns and under and cause collision damage if enemies are thrown into each other or into walls/objects maybe does additional damage the higher your perils.

Lightning staff

Left click - (Shock)
Current charged chain lightning animation but a slow damage over time centered around stunning hordes more than damage maybe shorten its range because of alternate fire.

Right click - (Conductor)
Blocks but electrocutes (Stunning) the attacker … no reposte slightly increased perils cost / block.

Alternate Fire - (Lightning bolt)
A fairly straight shooting large lightning bolt that cuts straight through all targets in a straight-ish line can be bounced off walls ceilings floors etc for fun angles. 30 percentish perils.

F - (Tesla Coil)
Roiling Cone in front that goes through all targets to medium range causing decent damage and heavy stun.

G - (Lighning Strike)
Puts to 100% perils Heavy damage and stun to a single target stun to nearby targets full range(anti sniper)

1 Like
2

Now i want to move on to the ones that would be new.
This first one would be a “Support” staff so the damage numbers may be lower without too much worry since the utility can easily make up for it. Biomancy staffs could have the advantage of adding more base(flat maximum before multipliers from trinkets) HP/toughness or damage resistance instead of normal offensive blessings.

Biomancy Staff
Left click - (Wound) - Inflicts bleed in a 30-50 degree cone in front of the psycher (medium to short range). cheap perils cost. low stagger (non-elite short stun only)

Right Click - (Harden Body)
Unique interaction: melee enemies more sften bounce off the block and are staggered for more but there is no reposte. most cost effective staff perils/block ratio.

Alternate Fire - (Fear wave)
Temporarily makes nearby enemies flee and fight to escape the psychers presence short like 3 seconds. (only effects pox walkers and regular gunners scabs/dregs).

G - (Stigmata)
Inflicts very heavy bleed on a single target and slows thier movement and attack speed.

F - (Life Leech) Does a 360 degree Aoe that inflicts Medium bleed in a small - medium area, allies heal from the bleed damage can heal chaos damage health but is only half as effective at healing it.

Divination Staff
Divination staff is about toughness manipulation and getting better use out of your other weapon slot.

Left Click - (Divine)
Builds stacks of a buff called Presience when attacking with a different weapon they automatically crit and remove a stack of presience presience stacks refresh duration on each cast of this left click or each use of a stack when firing a ranged weapon or attacking with a melee attack. Stacks up to 5 times and lasts for 20 seconds fromt he last use.

Right click - (precognition)
Instead of blocking, it removes stagger and increases toughness resistance for 10 seconds increases block efficiency on other weapons and dodge distance.

Alternate Fire - Magic Bullet (immediately switches to a heavy revolver even if not equiped) the revolver has one shot and it will automatically headshot and ricochet to nearby enemies headshotting them as well. heavy cost 30% perils.

F - (Jynx)
enemies next attack each will hit each other instead of allies.

G - (Hex)
Greatly slows 1 enemy’s attack speed and movement speed they inflict a portion of thier damage back to themselves (30-50% ?)

3

Would certainly be interesting to see

1 Like
4

Force swords:
They need to be broken up into the different disciplines as well but i think they should share a weapon slot with staffs as the psychers “Psychic weapon” and maybe one option to the psycher could be a talent that allows them to have an additional psychic weapon slot (3)

Force sword should have a higher probability of obtaining beneficial melee stats in thier blessings.
Such as flat bonus health before multipliers or toughness.

Force swords should be less impactful per moment but have better perils efficiency than staffs firmly placing you in a place of wizard vs melee when building psycher. they shouldnt have to be frail but they should give up something to be durable.
As a note most swords in 40k are “Balanced” and as such should all have a group advantage of better block efficiency.

Biomancy:
Passive - Should have a high chance of obtaining + Health perks and should have High penetration but low damage

Left Click
works like the powerswords current unempowered attacks. if empowered leeches a small amount of health per hit half as effective at healing chaos damaged health. (think 2 per target hit 1 chaos health after regular hp is full) and cuts like the current empowered power sword as far as cleaving. damage should be low like a regular sword.

Right Click - Very efficent block due to sword group and defensive nature. reposte should be a 50% of screen slash that inflicts bleed on targets. does not cost perils unless blocking ranged attacks.

Alternate Fire: (Recharge the Sword). should grant about 5-7 hits before the power field drops off the sword, the sword should regenerate “empowered attacks” while blocking or idle to its regular maximum. this should be relatively cost effective and cost little perils.

F - (Adrenaline Burst)
Psycher and allies in range Regenerate a percent of max HP over the next 10 seconds with no penalty to chaos damage healing however after the 10 seconds is up they slowly lose half of the regeneration as regular damage. should be a stringer heal than the staff during the 10 seconds but fairly similar in maximum effect after the expiration … making it better at healing chaos damage but not a significantly stringer overall heal.

G - (Exceed Limits)
Temporarily your melee impact damage is very high allowing you to ragdoll even normally resilient opponents causing knockdown to any nonboss/nonmonstrosity enemy and full hammer like ragdoll of regular enemies.

Divination
passive - Converts more damage to toughness from melee bonus base toughness high likelyhood.

Left Click -
Works as power sword(sharpshooter) presently does with the change that its default state is powered for 5-7 hits then stalls. when empowered all hits are weakspot and crit.

Right click -
very efficient block cost and reposte is a single target critical + weakspot hit.

Alternate Fire - (Doom)
A Triangle in front of you (Reverse cone) takes 50% more damage for 10 seconds.

G - (Probability Field) in a 360 degree area around the psycher enemies reflect damage back on themselves when attacking (even when blocked).

Pyromancy
Lowest sword chance for bonus health and toughness.
Left Click -
operates like power sword presently does except when empowered. when empowered it doesnt gain as much penetration as the other force swords but ignites targets struck by the weapon.

Right click - (Fire Shield)
Creates a fire barrier around the psycher any enemies that strike it in melee are ignited no reposte. costs perils/hit.

Alternate Fire: recharge the sword adds strikes back onto the sword if it stalls.

F - Places a Square of fire in front of the pyromancer that burns enemies in it much like ground fire. 30% ish perils to cast.

G - (Fireball) see pyromancer staff.

Telekinesis
Converts damage to toughness at a higher rate and a good chance for bonus base toughness.

Left Click -
as power sword but with higher physics damage. when empowered physics damage rises.

Right click - Most efficient block for psycher that blocks melee and ranged.

Alternate Fire - Recharge sword if it stalls.

F - Same telekinetic throw as the staff.

G - (Telkinetic Dome)
creates a small dome enemy ranged attacks cannot penetrate and protects from suppression.

Telepathy
Should be based around toughness resistance instead of max toughness/health.

Left Click - (Gain Insight)
operates like power sword presently except when empowered, each hit increases toughness resistance temporarily with maximum stacks ignore stun.

Right Click - is a regular block

Alternate Fire - Recharge hits on the weapon.

F - (Fear Wave) Same as staff

G - (Brain burst) Instant version copied from the staff.

Lighning Sword
Defensive strategy based around crowd control.

Left click: same as power sword but when empowered chains electricity to neighboring targets to the hit target stunning them for low damage.

Right click: slightly less efficient block than other swords but shocks enemies that attack stunning them. i would place it as slightly cheaper than fire shield.

F - (Lightning Bolt) same as staff shoots straight through all targets and reflects off walls ceiling and floor for dynamic angles.

G - (Lightning Bolt) Same as Staff

5

I decided to write this due to the general response of the community that psycher is the weakest class, and is viewed as generally “Unviable” in difficulty 5 because many of the tricks that make them strong from 20-30 do not scale into late game 4’s and 5’s difficulty. brain burst being the major offender. Almost every reason one would bring a psycher to a mission is outshined by a Sharpshooter in every way. Sharpshooters ahve the advantage of thier weapons scaling with content and having higher damage ratings as the game goes on. Brain burst does not scale and goes from a perfect noob toob weapon early due to its high base damage to a late game liability because it takes so many bursts to kill elites.

Psycher … honetly just doesn’t even feel like a psycher much … they seem so limited in scope and role. and a lot of that has to do with brain burst being the center of thier kit. Its a clunky slow tool with not enough payoff. more importantly theres so many flavors of psycher in the 40k universe the current implementation feels really reductive and doesn’t give off that feel of a “Space wizard” that psychers actually do in setting. I think modulating more of the psychers abilities and letting players pick and choos emore is going to leave you with a much healthier game state that is easier to balance.

Additionally the powersword is operating way too strongly, its attributes and effect on the battlefield would make way more sense on a psyckers force sword.

And i am still championing powered and force weapons default state being empowered and you needing to “restart or re-energize them” as far less tedious then constantly spamming the alternate fire on all of them … These weapons should be funsctional most of the time and create a moment of tension when they stall … not be a complete and nonstop annoyance to even use.

The current psycher F is incredibly wonky with hitbox and effect, it also generally viewed as -50 perils the ability … its really lame and feels a lot less fun to use than most other characters F ability even if its game power is decent.

I love game design, and frequent as many BETA tests as i can for game types that i like. you are welcome to use this material here in game at no cost. I want the game to succeed.
If you liked what i put here and would want someone to literally do the numbers specifically for it, I wouldn’t be opposed to working in the game development field and have composed such number systems before.

6

I dont feel like i would add a ton to the conversation so i didnt respond, but yeah everyone other than sharpshooter needs loving

very true

yes again