you can dodge bullets by sliding and you can slide right and left. by after dodge hit crouch.
nah, zealot is fine
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This makes no sense. The post is about high difficulties, do you expect FS to balance it so the class can carry you even if you cannot dodge? If someone else can do damnation with zealot easily so can you. Otherwise, stay on malice or skill issue.
Always weird to me in topics like this when people start replying like it’s just made, even though this thing is almost a month old before a certain somebody cough @Faldo cough brought it back from the grave followed up by some more people dragging it back kicking and screaming. I guess many don’t read the timestamps.
Anyway, zealot is fine. Some things need tweaking, like every class does, etc. (EG: Thunder hammer needs more of an identity/synergy, they need to decide if the chain weapons are bleed-y or not, more focused concepts like attack speed build versus crit versus bleed) If you’re struggling on damnation, that’s either a team issue or a personal issue (Or just a plain bad setup). I hate resorting to “skill issue lol” because it’s a cop out but it’s getting really, really, REALLY old seeing people whine and claim classes are unplayable and whatnot.
Hope this help:
Zealot Damnation Carry Guide:
i was saying it being possible for someone doesnt mean its balanced , i expect fs to balance it so that each class is viable and you can play any of them and feel usefull and wanted.
class’s need to be balanced vs each other in regards to the difficulties the differning player skills has nothing to do with it.
and what that dodge thing is about , youve lost me.
in your example what does it tell us that one person can do damnation easily with zealot? just that it falls within the bounds of posiblility and nothing to do with balance. to know that we would need to know how someone eaqually skilled and experinced does on other classes.and you could compare those. that differential would tell you something.
what your suggesting is akin to judging a car by the driver , just because my mum could enter every f1 race in team Ferrari and never finish the first lap doesnt suddenly make the car bad does it?
I hope this post was the result of early experiences and not actual feedback.
Zealot is easily the strongest class at the moment, as much as you all like to talk about sharpshooter.
Just like in every other similar thread, you are going to get answers like: “Person A is great with class B, so it’s OK”.
The truth is that there are a lot of people here who played Vermintide for years. And for them, Zealot seems OK because with almost all the classes in Vermintide, you used the same or similar mechanics in the game as you have to use with Zealot in DT.
Zealot requires you to know how and when to dodge/push/slide/block/push-attack/alt-attack (stagger) etc. and on top of that, the thing that is hardest to explain: postioning is most important for exactly this class.
The Vermintide elitism present in the community will not allow for a discussion on how the balance feels from the ground up for people experiencing the game mechanics for the first time.
Useful guide from a Vermintide veteran, but be honest what do you think about difficulty of classes from the perspective of new players?
If you want to play the hardest difficulty, you need to learn how to play the game.
I really don’t see your point, if you don’t know how to position, or how to effectively manage melee combat with dodges, pushes and knowing which attacks you have to use, why are you playing the hardest difficulty?
Learn the game, then play the hardest challenge it has to offer for the moment.
All 4 classes are dogsh*it if you don’t know how to stagger/dodge/push/position, and zealot is the one that allows more mistakes with faster stamina regen and being immortal every now and then.
You managed to completely miss to point and talk about something different.
Strawman argument - absolutely no one said otherwise.
It’s not a binary.
Some classes are not so dogsh* even if they are not so good at stagger/dodge/push/position. That’s why I said “…most important for exactly this class”, not “only important for this class”.
There’s a difference.
That maybe, just maybe, the higher difficulty isn’t for them at the moment? In fact that means they have some place to grow and learn the game mechanics and importance of team cohesion and communications.
There is nothing wrong with playing on lower difficulty level. Instead of writing half informed rants on the forums claiming that the x or y class is underpowered, I suggest people learn the game mechanics first, take advantage of them and treat Heresy and especially Damnation as a TEAM oriented challenge as it should be. If you cannot reach it, that is absolutely fine also.
This isn’t elitism speaking when “veterans” tell people that maybe they should take a breath and get better at the game, individually and on the team level. In fact I would say that players ranting on the forums that it must be the game’s fault that they cannot complete on the higher difficulty is a wanna be elitists problem. Stop obsessing with beating the game at the highest difficulty and enjoy it at the difficulty which gives you the correct mix of challenge, satisfaction and punishment.
hm… that’s an interesting question.
I think Psyker and Vet would be easier options.
Zealot is the most broken imo but requires a lot of skills. And it is exactly as you said, if you have V2 background in Cataclysm, you can pilot Zealot very effectively. As you can see in my vid at 6:54, if play correctly, Zealot can 1v20 gunners without losing a single hp. It is the most difficult class because you need to play fast, you have to know how to dodge, manage stamina, know how to position, know priority (what to kill first) otherwise you will definitely die going in like that. And I’m not talking about just “know”, you have to “really really know” what you are doing.
Regarding ogryn, I have not experienced this class to the fullest but according to the feats and abilities. The class doesn’t have much potential to clutch. It is good for the team, but if it’s Ogryn last man standing against a lot of enemies, it’s more likely over.
If I have to rank the OPness, it would be 1. Zealot, 2. Vet, 3. Psyker, and 4. Ogryn.
In general, I agree with your post, but this is not just about “you need to practice to beat high-level content”, this goes without saying. What I was explaining is specifically about Zealot since this is the topic.
What I am saying is: Zealot is deceptively easy on lower difficulties because you can just run into melee groups/horde and swing your TH. No blade-dancing around is required to not wipe.
In Heresy+, this strategy just doesn’t work, and players who haven’t played a lot of VT might feel like there’s something wrong with either their class or difficulty in general.
Then, in the forums, they are told that not only is Zealot not “too weak”, but is OP and the best class and you just need to practice more.
This is understandably confusing for new-to-tides players because they don’t understand when this is coming from players who have 1K+ hours in VT/VT2 and the skill transfer between games is huge in case of Zealot.
Exactly. That’s why we need to answer 2 questions:
- Is the Zealot too weak in higher difficulties?
No. - Is Zealot going to be harder then other classes for new-to-tides players in higher difficulties where you need to get near to Zealot’s high skill ceiling to be effective?
I think so.
Couldn’t be less of a straw man, as I wasn’t attacking you, I was attacking your argument.
There’s no point debating what you suggest, as someone without said skills shouldn’t be on “harder difficulties” to begin with, and that scenario is what OP talks about.
Is it harder to learn? I personally don’t think so, learning to dodge, push and stagger is just as hard with, for example, veteran, but veteran has worse toughness regen, worse stamina regen, and doesn’t prevent you from dying.
This is true for many other classes and general gameplay feel. You are no longer a god with enough gear score and talents as on Malice. Yes, the difficulty spike is noticable for newer players and vets alike.
This confusion is down to the point you made yourself, lower difficulties due to the enemy density and difficulty spikes aren’t good teachers really.
Oh yes, and this is why so many end up here demanding the difficulty is lowered, so they can feel good about themselves for beating the game at the difficulty setting which is designed for the few percent of the playerbase. Why should we rob that few percent from their game experience so the new masses could feel good about themselves without putting some simple effort into learning the ropes?
Zealot was one of my fav classes in V2, also Handmaiden and Unchained. I really tended to gravitate towards not meta builds on those, but this is beyond the point.
VT1/VT2 knowledge helps quite a bit, as melee and resource management are still important, but there is also a misguided expectation between some VT1/2 players that the experience in Darktide should be exactly the same. It isn’t.
There is no temp HP, toughness is harder to manage if you are alone and you lose it quickly due to the ranged enemies. Trash ranged mobs in Darktide pose far larger threat than monsters/bosses. Your squad benefits immensely on higher difficulties from well balanced team where everyone not only knows the game, but also their role. Having a dedicated range hunter veteran with Counterfire, two decent front-liners is a massive advantage. Clutch is far harder and a loss of one player can hurt a lot.
Yet in random teams I constantly see people playing in Heresy+ runs like they can solo it all. It doesn’t take a lot to make your experience far smoother: stay close, keep line of sight between each other and USE the line of sight and choke-points against the enemies. People just need to get some idea how to start to clear every new area and how to react to a horde waves as these tend to pull the ambiance also. Some “certain” builds on the Preacher might allow you to ignore the methodical approach, but you aren’t helping yourself and your squad if you pull too many groups and just slowly lose health due to the attrition.
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I agree, they should buff the Zealot’s toughness by a large amount (since his kit revolves on that) and heavily nerf the perk that gives damage reduction on crits since it generates the only one overpowered build the Zealot has access to.
I have to disagree with that. I play all classes, all leveled and on Damn. From my perspective Ogryn is actually the best clutch option. Yes you miss dmg/kill potential, but you have many boosts to picking up downed teamm8s or getting to the captured ones. And I am not talking about shield build either.
Your ability to get to anyone fast, ability to pick up without interreuption and faster than other classes. Momentum blessing on weapons, most Oggy ranged weapons are a cc/horde clear as well. Bloodthirst (+10% dmg res per bleeding enemy up to 50%) or Hard as nails (-25% dmg taken stacks with downed or incapacitated allies).
For me Psyker is least likely to survive in clutch, that really depends on staff used and enemy composition, tbf Veteran would probably be down there if not for Power Sword really. Just my opinion though.
That’s good to know 
Yeah I’ve been Veteraning Damnation, even soloing for significant stretches, and I think Ogryn is great for Damnation
Zealot is fine on Heresy at least. I have not cared to play him on Damnation yet tbh. Heresy loadout is Autogun + Thunder Hammer, recharge Toughness in close combat, heal from damage dealt at 1hp, double charge
I strongly recommend thy wrath be swift. The description is false and it actually prevents all stuns, including from ranged attacks. Incredibly impactful feat.
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