I almost fully agree, but I think only the fully charged attack should ignore shields. Or how about this: simple charged attack ignores breakable shields, but only fully charged ignores Shieldvermin-shields?
It’s already mandatory. Why would you use anything but Swift Slaying on it, especially now when it’s so extremely slow?
1h hammer and 2h hammer both have decent damage cleave and strong stagger cleave. I’m also not seeing how it’s pertinent that the light attacks specifically have good cleave, since warpick lights are slower than 2h hammer heavies.
Yeah I want to increase attack speed too, buddy.
And it sure as hell wouldn’t be useless when it’s capable of cleaving 3 Chaos Marauders and dealing damage equal or close to 1h axe lights.
I would be very wary of increasing heavy attack speed by any significant amount, since that’s the actual decent part of the weapon. 5% is a decent buff, especially when you consider all the other attack speed buffs Slayer and RV can get. It’s just that in this case light attacks are still slow even after significant attack speed steroids.
Disagree on ‘all’. I’d make uncharged heavies ignore Marauder and Clanrat shields, and charged heavies ignore Stormvermin shields.
Push-attack has high weapon damage. If we were to go with your suggestion of leaving the damage of lights unchanged, you would make the weapon into spamming push-attacks, cause they’d have significantly better DPS.
Pickaxe is identical to Coghammer currently, but just worse. Buffing it to make it on-par with Coghammer would make them practically identical. I’d rather not have 2 distinct weapons be identical.
Disagree. I’m not seeing how it being ‘somewhat unwieldy’ makes it worthy of having the lowest mobility stats in the game, on par with 2h hammer. Visually it’s a lot lighter, and from a gameplay perspective it makes sense to give Bardin more variety with a weapon that has polearm levels of mobility. I’m not seeing how it makes it too similar to 1h axe when mobility is still significantly worse, it’d still be slower, but it’d have much more impressive heavy attacks and actual cleave on light attacks.
Yes, I should have probably said that it should remain a strong option against armour. Even then though, I’d say 2h hammer is better at killing armour, cause you attack much faster, making you more flexible and capable of making use of the stagger damage bonus. Another thing could be to make uncharged heavies more viable too. They deal very low damage currently and overshadowed by full charged heavies.
Anyways, to add on to my previous suggestion:
Uncharged heavies ignore Marauder and Clanrat shields;
Charged heavies ignore Stormvermin shields;
Higher monster DPS;
Stronger uncharged heavies (equal to 1h axe heavies?).
Well it really needs a job since the weapons identity currently is all over the place.
Power attack breaking shields does sound interesting but it should only ignore vermin shields when its fully charged and not before it.
Otherwise I agree what @Rebel suggested.
Coghammer is what warpick should have been from the start
So is we want WP not to end up like reskinned coghammer WP breaking shields is not enough
WP Should imho have the HIGHEST anti armor dmg + very decent stagger on light and heavies in the game WITG VERY little cleave - akin to one handed axe = so clanrats/slaves/fanatics max 2 targets hit, everything else only 1 hit
But alfa dmg should be one hit with light attacks (no headshot needed) for clanrats/slaves/fanatics, only +10% needed for mauler one shot (no headshot needed)
Stormvermin also one shot achievable withotu headshot with +20% power
Heavy attacks should be the absolute BANE of anything they touch, we are talking CHW oneshots with Stage 1 heavies after some power investment
Stage 2 heavy should chunk health from bosses
Also faster stage 2 charging would be preferable
And lets not kid outselves even if it was like this - obscenely powerfull vs 1 target, 2HA 2HH Coghammer Dual Hammers would be picked more since they deal with all type of threats just fine
BUT atleast warpick would hold the king OHK weapons of vermintide
For Cata or Legend? The partial heavy 1 shotting a CW on headshot on either difficulty, but especially on Cata, would be ludicrously high damage for the speed, stagger and base bodyshot damage of that attack. Increasing the boss damage is reasonable enough. It’s disappointing seeing those Dawi-Drop Warpick Slayers doing so little to a boss.
And thats okay
Coghammer on slayer gibs CHW on legend and I think crit gibs on CATA without headshot
ON TOP of this it has very decent cleave stagger attack speed combination on lights
For WP to be unique it has to be reverse greatsword essentialy
I’m sorry, what? You want light attacks to one-shot maulers, Stormvermin and Chaos Warriors with partial heavies? On Cataclysm? That’d be balanced if it had 0 cleave and 1.5s attack speed, maybe. I’m just not sure that you realize how stupid overpowered your suggestion is. It would put the weapon in a completely different realm of reality from all the other current weapons in the game.
Davi drop warpick seemed like a amazing ‘‘off meta’’ very fun way for a slayer to gib CHW on cata and deal nice chunks to bosses
Instead its borderlina unusable and you have a essentialy dead melee slot since 2HA 2HH na COG are all straight up better than WP
The Cog Hammer with 3 stacks of Trophy Hunter, Skull Splitter, Smiter and 10% vs Chaos on Slayer will take 2 crit heavy bodyshots to kill a Cata CW, or 1 crit heavy headshot and 1 normal heavy bodyshot. It’s arguably overtuned, similar to how Exec is on GK. Fortunately Fatshark didn’t make it do more damage per attack than Warpick (though I wouldn’t be surprised at all if Cog Hammer had higher sustained dps (Edit: Scratch that, its sustained dps is luckily lower from a quick look at some numbers)).
SO what is your solution for WP
Another weapon that deals with everything?
Or just slap shield break so its still objectively worse than other dwarf weapons but those shield vermin will die little sooner?
WP gibing UN armored enemies (except maulers) on 1 hit with small power investment WITH a tradeoff of very small cleave is not op on the slightest
SW which are pretty much counted as trash against more meta weapons - 2HA on slayer gibs SW without the need of a headshot, Heavies cleave through hordes liek butter, and still cna deal with CHW well enough
WP being THE highest single target dmg weapon in the game that lacks almost all cleave will make it more niche than it is now BUT it will have a VERY clear playstyle and role in a team
What you proposed makes another slight variant to 2HH 2HA Coghammer
Sure it makes WP better cuz all things you listed are straight buffs
But iam sicked and tired all weapons being made ‘‘it has to be good vs everything’’ mentality
Now what I suggested would create a weapon BAD in horde situations, REALLY bad
But when it came to armor chw and bossed it would start to outshine 2HA 2HH and Cog
I think Rebel’s suggestions would let it fill a niche that is lacking for Bardin - a decently versatile 2h that has moderate mobility, like the polearms other characters have, but while still being a dwarf weapon.
Just increasing the attack speed a bit, increasing push attack cleave and improving heavies just enough to justify the charge time would be enough; whether that be piercing shields on full charges, increasing damage or simply reducing the charge time.
How is it another slight variant when the cleave would be significantly worse and the killing power is much higher? It wouldn’t be great against hordes, wouldn’t be very good against mixed hordes and would have average defensive stats.
Well I think what you suggested is absolutely broken. Light attacks that, with some attack speed buffs, get to 05s, you’re killing a Stormvermin and Mauler completely brainlessly every half second. You’re singlehandedly completely destroying patrols. And in this case the drawback of it being “weak” against hordes is completely negligible due to the completely insane killing power. You destroy all the elites from a mixed horde and one shot everything. And how can you POSSIBLY justify one shotting Chaos Warriors with partial heavies? And none of this is with headshots either. And what would the use be for full charged attacks? Monster damage? Only if it takes a quarter away every second, and then you’re killing Cataclysm bosses singlehandedly in 4 seconds. And what about push-attacks? What use would they have?
Just, no dude.
Hammers have 2 dodge count and 0% dodge range. Polearms have 3 dodge count and 0-15% dodge range. He’s talking about mobility. And even then, how are they comparable when the killing power of polearms is much higher than coghammer and 2h hammer? They’re different weapons.