If the wall could move forward you could at least make a case for it. Place it and push forward alongside it in a gunner heavy environment.
there it is
Honestly Havoc is a joke because people learn so little about the game on their ‘journey’ there they permanently settle on a plateau of crutches and cannot play without them. I hate everyone who wants to play that mode exclusively, look at the takes it leads to. Its like permanently riding a bike on training wheels, then telling others how to run a marathon. If they would have done anything, anything else, with this mode the game would be so much better. But its not and we get to listen to horrible takes from people who can barely limp through it in a pre made using every crutch.
With all due respect, for players who supposedly love the challenge, we certainly have seen a lot of resistance coming from that region’s playerbase to ANY nerfs, and obsessive “meta” culture.
For sake of your game enjoyment, and the game’s balance, I really hope those are false generalisations.
and this is the kind of posts you start to see when balance is left to rot for a long time, granted i at least hope fatshark can have a separate client for that region since they seem to prefer power fantasy scaling but who am i kidding
What kind of posts? Great way to dismiss a well-written feedback just because you disagree with their balance take. You guys have a hate boner to every opinion that’s not your cookie cutter, one-dimensional “nerf ds, plasma, voc, kraks”.
They even admitted in their post that Pickpocket was problematic outside of Havoc and supported their case on why everyone uses bubble and voc in Havoc 40, aka there’s not enough case to use other stuff (bubble → protects against shooters, grants toughness regen, blocks BON’s bile, covers you from all sides).
They use smoke grenades on asians servers, as much as I dislike smokes, they still require more understanding of the game than kraks which everyone uses nowadays in EU servers. So I guess using one of the hardest to use blitzes in the game makes them meta slaves too?
When a forum becomes an echo chamber, you get arrogant, exclusionary comments like yours. But I won’t be intimidated by people like you, letting you take over the forum and dismiss normal player feedback with such disgusting remarks.
Why don’t we just go back three years? Veterans didn’t have VoC back then. I’m sure that was the golden age of the game, right?
I assume you’re one of the people here that thinks this is the first time this has happened with players from that region.
That’s purely your own definition. I’ve spent a long time trying to clear Havoc40 with just two players.
Far from it. The game had as many, if not more problems back then. Also the game had the same meta picks as ever. Bolter was actually stronger than Plasma gun back then. Lasgun 12 was one of the best generalist weapons in the game. The revolver decimated the meta for close to a year. Knife was the best melee with no other melee weapon coming close.
Anyone who says the game was better back then looks at it through rose-tinted glasses.
Look man, HK for duos is less painful than west somehow
Confucius was cooking with that phrase goddamn. Wonder if he played fatshark games back then.
Why does everyone complain about classes getting nerfed or buffed, but nobody talks about the real problem? The enemies—even the most basic ones—have such an absurd and stupid amount of HP that most talents, weapons, and strategies have become completely obsolete.
On asian servers way more people play Havoc in prime time. They view it as the endgame, and not just an additional gamemode with different rules, like many EU and US players do.
And that makes sense. Auric with a full party can be completed with any ability very easily, as long as you don’t outright sabotage your team or don’t go down every 30 seconds (so dying more often than you get your cooldowns). Since there’s no scoreboard in the base game, it’s hard to judge how much everyone did compared to one another in auric, meaning it’s hard to judge how efficient builds are.
Meanwhile in Havoc it’s much harder to get carried, even with a full team. When you have a bad teammate who can’t even use his abilities correctly, you easily feel the difference. You can sprint to clear the sped-up ritual (the correct play), and your teammates simply ignore it, which makes the run unsalvagable if you don’t have the build to solo clear it. If Ogryn doesn’t keep enemies in check with their taunt, the team will get overwhelmed from all sides. If Vet fights in melee instead of shooting the gunners, the Psyker’s bubble won’t survive even for 5 seconds.
My understanding is that they don’t care for auric at all at this point. And who can blame them? Fatshark negletcs auric themselves, using it for events only.
I know it’s an alien concept to most forum players, since most people here already have a premade of skilled players to play Havoc with, but that’s the reality than the majority of players face. Playing with randoms, even those using meta stuff, is way harder than playing with 4 good or even above average players.
Asian players view the game balance in a different light, and it’s about time these forums stop pretending their takes is bad, just because they don’t insert “nerf DS” into every sentence.
If pox gas wasn’t designed solely with golden toughness in mind, why does stealth and exe stance users suffer from it way more than voc users? Why does pox gas block highlighting feature of exe stance, and not golden toughness overshield effect? Why does it mess up breakpoints of exe stance when it’s the only reason to bring exe stance, to hit those breakpoints one bullet earlier?
Rinda Karnak’s 3 hit combo and sword swipe charge attack instantly kills Vet and Psyker at full HP without golden toughness if it hits you in Havoc 40.
Did you, perchance, read what came immediately after that paragraph? The whole point of what your quoted was to NOT argue about whether or not that statement is true, but to instead point out a more sensible thing to advocate for to address that issue.
Accordingly I have nothing particularly to say in response to the information you’ve shared 
This is something I’ve said many times before, but the root of the problem is the huge gap in overall difficulty between regular missions and Havoc.
If you balance the game around Auric, Havoc becomes completely absurd. But if you balance around Havoc, everything below Auric effectively turns into a tutorial.
Yet Fatshark has ignored this fundamental issue for years instead of addressing it. Carapace spam and the armor problems are only symptoms. Unless the core problem is fixed, the balance discussion will never end.
The Darktide team shares nothing about their philosophy on balance, and there is no real communication with players. There’s no active CM presence, and even Quickpaw has gone silent.
For me, this forum has essentially become nothing more than a wall of graffiti. That’s why I barely post here anymore.
Right now the forum is just a place where discarded frustrations accumulate. Players put real effort into suggesting improvements, the developers ignore them, and a few months later someone else comes along and posts the exact same thing again. It feels like watching an endless loop.
If the development team gave even a single official response, the same discussions wouldn’t keep resurfacing over and over again. But if you look through the archives, it’s obvious: discussions about balance have been circling the exact same spot for years without any real progress.
Honestly, watching the same topics repeat again and again sometimes feels like watching people with memory loss having the same conversation over and over.
^ Good post.
That’s because Havoc degrades the base player stats, with 200 toughness you can regen faster than you get chipped by gas if you have iron will (catch a breath is mandatory and executioner gives you constant toughness). Meanwhile there is absolutely nothing impacting gold toughness…