# Vanguards need a rework **URL:** \ **Category:** Gameplay Feedback\ **Created:** [June 28, 2026, 8:45am UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/vanguards-need-a-rework/123226 "2026-06-28T08:45:29Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![DerNachtschreck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ee7513/32.png) [@DerNachtschreck](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/DerNachtschreck)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2026, 8:45am UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/vanguards-need-a-rework/123226/1 "2026-06-28T08:45:30Z")
I believe all is said about these, I just want to hop on the train. Why release a fun class, with fun weapons and do good changes to simultanisly force you into playstyles, because that “elite” is so badly written? Not fun! Check your own game Vermintide 2 and take a look. ---
**Author:** ![TyphonThor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/858c86/32.png) [@TyphonThor](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/TyphonThor)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2026, 9:08am UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/vanguards-need-a-rework/123226/2 "2026-06-28T09:08:06Z")
The “elite” that is not even an actual Elite, so they do not count as Elite kills. Yet are more annoying to deal with than any other actual Elite. Not only are they tough as nails with the shield up for most weapons and do decent dmg back to you, break the shield and they get stagger immune and do even more dmg and look just like every other mook around them. Oh yeah, and they have a lot of health too. Quite frankly they are just really [insert June/July starsign]. ---
**Author:** ![andreas1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d26b3c/32.png) [@andreas1](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/andreas1)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2026, 10:19am UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/vanguards-need-a-rework/123226/3 "2026-06-28T10:19:49Z")
I don’t think they need a rework tbh, but they should lower the armor/health of the actual mob to the same as any other trash mob. I don’t mind the shield being tanky as hell, but if i manage to get a shot in behind it, it should die like any other. ---
**Author:** ![DerNachtschreck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ee7513/32.png) [@DerNachtschreck](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/DerNachtschreck)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2026, 10:43am UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/vanguards-need-a-rework/123226/4 "2026-06-28T10:43:54Z")
Which would be a rework 😉 ---
**Author:** ![KJeraD](https://dub1.discourse-cdn.com/flex013/user_avatar/forums.fatsharkgames.com/kjerad/32/69592_2.png) [@KJeraD](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/KJeraD)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2026, 10:50am UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/vanguards-need-a-rework/123226/5 "2026-06-28T10:50:34Z")
So which part of them is “not fun” to interact with? You haven’t specified this in your post. I’ve started playing other classes again and haven’t really been having significant issues with dispatching vanguard bruisers all too much - there are also weapons that either ignore (chain weapons’ rev attacks; force swords’ special attacks), or force breaking of their shields (typically weapons with powerful energised activated attacks, like Thunder hammer, Power maul on Ogryn or Zealot’s/Arbiter’s Crusher), which is fantastic, since some otherwise “fair” weapons have just gotten an edge over the “good” options. ---
**Author:** ![DerNachtschreck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ee7513/32.png) [@DerNachtschreck](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/DerNachtschreck)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2026, 11:18am UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/vanguards-need-a-rework/123226/6 "2026-06-28T11:18:29Z")
I did. They force certain weapons/builds. They have 360 protection, a bad head hitbox, headshots have 50% reduced damage, they have stagger immunity, etc etc etc etc Tell me how this is good design? If you think it works, enjoy. If all experienced players are vocal about bad design and analyse that on point, maybe check it out. ---
**Author:** ![ShyBandit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/4da419/32.png) [@ShyBandit](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/ShyBandit)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2026, 11:34am UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/vanguards-need-a-rework/123226/7 "2026-06-28T11:34:22Z")
I feel like they need an urgent rework because this just sucks. Either give them a new model and elite status so they can be identified from a distance and planned around, if they’re gonna be kept on the same power level as a mauler, or they need a severe drop in both shield durability, stagger resistance, and base health so they actually feel like a Standard Scab Melee-r With A Shield. They cannot maintain low status and reused model while actually genuinely having as much or more effective HP than a Gunner/Shotgunner **AFTER YOU GET RID OF THEIR SHIELD** , they cannot just have both. ---
**Author:** ![MadMartigan](https://dub1.discourse-cdn.com/flex013/user_avatar/forums.fatsharkgames.com/madmartigan/32/85568_2.png) [@MadMartigan](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/MadMartigan)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2026, 11:44am UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/vanguards-need-a-rework/123226/8 "2026-06-28T11:44:19Z")
I think they’re good enemies but they should either be called elites and put in armour and taggable, or have their body hp reduced (but keep shield hp the same). ---
**Author:** ![AccountMadeToReply](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/82dd89/32.png) [@AccountMadeToReply](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/AccountMadeToReply)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2026, 11:46am UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/vanguards-need-a-rework/123226/9 "2026-06-28T11:46:34Z")
i think the new enemies are just fine and people are just continuing to whine and complain too early like they always do and always will do ---
**Author:** ![andreas1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d26b3c/32.png) [@andreas1](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/andreas1)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2026, 11:47am UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/vanguards-need-a-rework/123226/10 "2026-06-28T11:47:30Z")
No, that’s not a rework. That’s just balancing. ---
**Author:** ![f8fqgfm](https://dub1.discourse-cdn.com/flex013/user_avatar/forums.fatsharkgames.com/f8fqgfm/32/115889_2.png) [@f8fqgfm](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/f8fqgfm)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2026, 11:55am UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/vanguards-need-a-rework/123226/11 "2026-06-28T11:55:39Z")
_Are you saying that if a situation gets complained about as soon as it appears, that proves players lack adaptability and can’t accept new things; but if a situation gets complained about for a long time, that also proves players lack adaptability, because the situation has existed so long that many have had to passively put up with it, and yet you still stubbornly cling to your views? So in the end, even when there are obvious issues with data and mechanics, those who have concerns should just stay silent—is that it?_ ---
**Author:** ![AccountMadeToReply](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/82dd89/32.png) [@AccountMadeToReply](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/AccountMadeToReply)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2026, 11:58am UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/vanguards-need-a-rework/123226/12 "2026-06-28T11:58:13Z")
no i like the new enemy and they are fun to fight, and a lot of people are just complaining about it to be complaining, thats just what happens with every update, people will complain, i think those people need to shut up for once 🤣 Literally every.single.update. people come out of the wood-works to start flooding the forums with complaint posts leave the enemy as is, gather feedback in like a month or two from the community, next major update make changes if need be, people instantly jump in and want the entire enemy reworked and changed to be an elite and this and that and… just shut up for once lmao, let the enemy be slightly difficult for once ---
**Author:** ![DerNachtschreck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ee7513/32.png) [@DerNachtschreck](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/DerNachtschreck)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2026, 12:30pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/vanguards-need-a-rework/123226/13 "2026-06-28T12:30:02Z")
Yeah if people are critical they are always the same whiny blablabla. Check the forum how much I complained, after almost 1000 hours ingame. If you dont like an opinion and you dont argue with reason jog on. And one could say you are just a “Yes all is amazing I love all 1000/10” guy, because you dont want people to express their thoughts. ---
**Author:** ![TyphonThor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/858c86/32.png) [@TyphonThor](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/TyphonThor)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2026, 12:37pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/vanguards-need-a-rework/123226/14 "2026-06-28T12:37:06Z")
Dude, the enemy is generally more obnoxious than the Bulwarks they replace. And they always comes in fives or more. And yes, there are ways to deal with them easily. A way that is often counter to the rest of the game design. This game is designed to be fast paced in every way, and these things are designed to keep you there hitting them for longer than it takes to down a Mauler or Crusher. And they are just “normal” mooks. Normal trash mobs that are tougher than 90% of the Elites. ---
**Author:** ![f8fqgfm](https://dub1.discourse-cdn.com/flex013/user_avatar/forums.fatsharkgames.com/f8fqgfm/32/115889_2.png) [@f8fqgfm](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/f8fqgfm)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2026, 12:56pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/vanguards-need-a-rework/123226/15 "2026-06-28T12:56:30Z")
> [@AccountMadeToReply](#): > > no i like the new enemy and they are fun to fight, and a lot of people are just complaining about it to be complaining, thats just what happens with every update, people will complain, i think those people need to shut up for once 🤣 > > Literally every.single.update. people come out of the wood-works to start flooding the forums with complaint posts > > leave the enemy as is, gather feedback in like a month or two from the community, next major update make changes if need be, people instantly jump in and want the entire enemy reworked and changed to be an elite and this and that and… just shut up for once lmao, let the enemy be slightly difficult for once People flood the forum with complaints because that is genuinely how they feel. Players think this way because what Fatshark’s designers were thinking with this design. They should have clearly anticipated the fierce backlash, for seasoned developers ought to have a solid grasp of how their own design will land. ---
**Author:** ![AccountMadeToReply](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/82dd89/32.png) [@AccountMadeToReply](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/AccountMadeToReply)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2026, 1:00pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/vanguards-need-a-rework/123226/16 "2026-06-28T13:00:09Z")
yes this is a good thing 👍 ---
**Author:** ![TyphonThor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/858c86/32.png) [@TyphonThor](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/TyphonThor)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2026, 1:06pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/vanguards-need-a-rework/123226/17 "2026-06-28T13:06:39Z")
You are probably the only one that thinks so. But you do have a right to your own opinions. No one can or should be able to take those away. Personally I think they should be “normal” trash mobs in every way, just with the obnoxious shields. Break shield, they die in one hit. No massive health pool, no stagger immunity, and not hit harder than the enemy they for all intents and purposes appears to be. Or make them count as Elites… and give them an distinct visual design with a size increase. ---
**Author:** ![AccountMadeToReply](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/82dd89/32.png) [@AccountMadeToReply](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/AccountMadeToReply)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2026, 1:09pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/vanguards-need-a-rework/123226/18 "2026-06-28T13:09:17Z")
> [@DerNachtschreck](#): > > dont want people to express their thoughts. people can express their thoughts, i don’t care about that, but this: ![image](https://europe1.discourse-cdn.com/flex013/uploads/fatshark/original/3X/c/c/cc2fd11a15f2c5c11504371306f07cbb72faadfb.png) ![image](https://europe1.discourse-cdn.com/flex013/uploads/fatshark/original/3X/c/c/cc60d870ce46b91a40a66495e08f297178295bd4.png) ![image](https://europe1.discourse-cdn.com/flex013/uploads/fatshark/original/3X/9/2/92b2e2205e35f9bef1daf84365e26f07b7cb086b.png) this is just whining, I don’t see this as voicing opinions or concerns immediately after the update by the way, people should just wait at least a few weeks before they start trying to give their ‘feedback’ ---
**Author:** ![AccountMadeToReply](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/82dd89/32.png) [@AccountMadeToReply](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/AccountMadeToReply)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2026, 1:13pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/vanguards-need-a-rework/123226/19 "2026-06-28T13:13:40Z")
> [@TyphonThor](#): > > Personally I think they should be “normal” trash mobs in every way and i dont, i actually enjoy hitting the enemy a few times before they die, its genuinely an enjoyable experience to interact with this games melee combat system and its pretty much what has kept me playing for so long im tired of enemies getting instantly vaporized by every weapon on every class, its a nice change of pace to hit an enemy a few more times if theres too many of the new enemy and they have too much hp and theyre too hard… maybe turn the difficulty down? theres quite a few difficulty levels ---
**Author:** ![temp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f04885/32.png) [@temp](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/temp)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2026, 1:17pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/vanguards-need-a-rework/123226/20 "2026-06-28T13:17:42Z")
> [@TyphonThor](#): > > Dude, the enemy is generally more obnoxious than the Bulwarks they replace Vanguards are much nicer than Bulwarks. I’ve failed many missions because just a single Bulwark was camping the respawn point, and that ONE Bulwark alone kept me from quickly reviving my teammates by hiding behind his impenetrable shield [Next page](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/vanguards-need-a-rework/123226.md?page=2)