Traits and Properties - Suggestion for adjustments

Have you considered throwing the bombs at the enemy instead of at your team?

Also I don’t disagree decanter and concoction are better in QP if you know literally nobody, but QP is QP and your build barely matters there. It not being good if your team doesn’t handle the 100% extra use for each potion well doesn’t mean proxy is a meme. Proxy is insanely good in a lot of situations.

As for the OP I pretty much agree with incans first post. Divine aim is cool (and it should be an OE passive), and an extra dodge count is fine but should be on a weapon, not applying to both as essentially free mobility. I also like the star of the sisterhood talent here, though it would be potentially way too strong in some comps I think? Depends what you mean by effect there.

Cool to see someone trying to create new ideas though.

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I’ll make sure to expect that people will read my mind and not rush into the exact area where I throw the bomb.

Anything specific? I may have overlooked some abuse potential. Also, as I said in the OP. I just can’t take my own preferences alone. So let’s say that I took a similar approach to the weapon rebalance. I cut off the top 5- 10 % while giving more suitable choices below. Nothing suggested here should compare to the top traits/properties combination.

The main idea is to give more customization towards very specific stuff like being super-resistent against disablers but having to open your “flanks” on other sides like Hordes being more dangerous due to less health.

this is nutty

that’s a 10 minute potion yo, even at 20% effect that’s wild

also likely to be busted

and then all the stagger power stacking could very easily have some adverse balance effects.

Works for me, though even if you do tag them a bit, who cares? It’s a single instance of FF, it’s not that big a deal. Most of the time you’re pulling out a bomb without shrapnel you’re in a pretty dicey situation anyway.

God imagine this with potion RV? Basically just permanent concoction lmao

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well also just popping a strength pot since armour pen isn’t a thing that can be reduced by a percentage; it’s a boolean function

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Just few mentions:

Swift Winds - Increases Attack Speed by 2 % per hit up to 20 % (new calculation), resets upon dodge

Resets upon dodge? Sounds absolutely useless. Maybe it should reset with time?

Coordinated Defense - Increased defense for each other player close to you up to 20 %

What’s defense? Damage reduction? Stamina regen? Stamina?

Parry - Timed blocks reduce stamina cost by 100% and Blocking an attack increases the amount of damage the attacker takes by 20% for 5 seconds

Riposte would be a good name change in the case of this talent then.

Ressourceful Combatant - Every 5 headshots recovers 5 % ammunition

Taking out career skill CDR trait is a bad idea because it’s useful. Just make this a separate talent.

  • 1 Dodge counter

If that would be dodge distance/speed - aight, but I’m not seeing +1 dodge being viable, especially when it competes with attack speed, BCR etc.

  • 10 % Power vs Beastmen

Too niche.

  • 20 % Effective range + 7.5 % Dodge Range

That’s super niche and borderline useless.

Dilution - Potion effect will be reduced to 20 %. Duration will increase by 6000 %

The hell lol

Divinve Aim - Bombs do not cause friendly fire

Kinda useless. Bomb damage is not that high. Situations where you would like to use a non-trait bomb just not to hurt your teammate are scarce.

Though, I liked decent amount of ideas, especially that are more about unique abilities and stats.

Natural Instinct - Highlights Specials within a radius of 25 m

That’s really cool and in combination with WHC I’d say this is really strong. Can be viable on careers like Huntsman that have really good ammo regeneration even without traits.

Honestly the game could use more unique traits and stats like this.

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You know, some of these less impactful traits and properties (existing and suggested ones) would be quite interesting but can’t ever compete with best-in-slot optimal stuff.

Makes me wish there was a way to add them without directly competing with the existing “minmaxer favorite” stats. Additional separate slots or even bound to an item, if you will. Hard to do without worrying about power creep of course, and maybe it just creates the same problem for THOSE slots instead of tackling the problem at the root (which should still be done anyway), but I’d love to try it.

huh I actually didn’t know that, figured there were degrees of armor pen

Is it? You mean the 100 %? It would need coordination between two or more players hitting the same enemy/enemies in sequence. I think it would only be reach these values versus monster or maybe Chaos Warriors. Or do you mean the 20 % already? Because it is onle the second strike to which most enemies already die anyway.

That’s um a zero to much I think. I had about two minutes in mind. Will have to correct that one.

In coordinated groups yea. I could try to adapt it to reduce the effect with increasing player numbers. But if only two people use it, it would be less effective then Proxy although not reliant on closeness. Starting with three it would become pretty strong, yea.

Only in very minor cases I think. Because right now you already have + 10 % stagger power with the Power versus x traits. If the 5 % are making that much difference I don’t know. It is versus all enemies though. Would have to be tested and to be adjusted in numbers. Maybe reducing to 7.5 % but keeping it versus all enemies. But I thought people would flock to the property which increases damage as well.

Would like to test anyway if people can cover around this. There are some situations it would work I think, unless you want an 100 % uptime. This is not possible.

DR, yes. Will correct it.

Already used :stuck_out_tongue:

Currently, it isnt as you can reach the same or better results with Swift Slaying concerning the reduction. But I admit that this one is mostly due to personal preference because I think that we can use career skills to often.

Heh, I already have someone in this thread saying the complete opposite.

You’re probably right. But I dont want them integrated in Chaos. So either this or not at all.

I think it would be helpful on something like Masterwork Pistol? Maybe on some other sniping weapons too.

One zero to much :stuck_out_tongue:

Again, have conflicting statements for this one.

Just to clarify, it is only highlighted (green or something). It doesnt count as tagged.

My take? You have to pull the root. I don’t see any way to add more or different traits and properties without removing the minmaxer favorite stats. However, so far I have only identified two properties which I think that they have to go. The rest can stay without creating to much issues.

My main issue is that dodge dancing is too much of a basic and crucial technique in this game even if you don’t stack BCR + Stamina.

Then it’s one of ideas I like then, though it’s kinda similiar to Foot Knight’s aura.

True, but I was talking from a “let’s change a lot” position you were taking in this thread. Anyway, that’s just a nitpick. I felt like bonus damage after blocking is the definition of riposte, so the same can be said about crit, they can both be riposte.

I wasn’t arguing with the fact it’s as meta as Swift Slaying. I was saying it’s viable. And it’s definitely is. Shade with this trait is even more broken, I’ve seen IB’s running this stuff with great success. Though, yeah, on regular difficulties below modded Swift Slaying is the absolute king.

Well, our communities just tend to have absolutely different opinions on the topic. Though, they were responsible for many changes in the previous balance patch. Do majority of weapons look even or balanced even on Cata after BBB? Not that much to me.

I agree, but that can just lead to another filler/useless property and I kinda dislike the idea.

I haven’t seen anyone die from a bomb (unless done intentionally just to troll) for the past 500~ hours in this game. And situation where people use the bomb with radius trait + power potion were so often on my experience. I just can’t comprehend a situation where this is useful and I haven’t seen people mention such situations too.

Ah, then it’s just okay. Not really strong, not useless either. I like it that way more. So far my favourite idea.

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Well, as much as I value the entertaining conversation and the traffic to the topic, it is kinda off-topic.

Would anyone (mainly @Incandescent , @DezZzO ) have an issue if I ask @FatsharkJulia to remove all off-topic posts (including this one) here so that we can concentrate or ignore the actual topic at hand (how I secretely try to remove Swift Slaying meta)?

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They use BW ult to clip back up a point-of-no-return in this video anyway so I guess they know a thing or two about these things :^)

(they don’t show their mod list in this either)

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Not at all. I would actually agitate for the fact that this conversation should be removed at once due to it having absolutely no relevance to the topic.
Pardon me for offtopic messages, but as I said multiple times I dislike ignoring people.

yet you don’t show your mod list and also use a Battle Wizard exploit in a “world first” video.

that’s very big brain m8. Also yeah @Adelion go for it, I’m not fussed, I owe you a beer (or a few) one day and we’ll call it even eh?

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For sure, and I don’t think there is an easy way to make swift slaying less borderline mandatory without moving some of its power to just the weapons themselves. If it gave less of a bonus but some weapons just had base faster animations, you’d probably be able to justify other traits sometimes.

Outside of that, weapon speed is basically universally useful in a way other traits may not be.

Speedruns have leaderboards, modded vermintide does not. Claims of faked speedruns require proof also, not just vague assertions that it’s possible.

If you’re going to make an accusation make one, don’t sit there acting like a 15 year old girl trying to start drama without it being obvious she’s where the rumor came from.

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Let’s continue the thread topic.

Remove, or completely make attack speed stacking completely irrelevant for fast weapons?

This suggests a level of diminishing returns yeah. Though to what degree I guess remains to be seen; there’s a lot to go through to determine what would be reasonable

Nah dude I was just arguing :^)

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