SotT is a far inferior "support" class if she ignores damage talents

Free shot…would be more impressive if scrounger and conservative shooter didnt work so well on it.

Some people like hunter too but heck, you kinda wana run doomsight with that.

Neither of which do anything with moonbow or the staff. Wow power creep really is pretty extreme when a talent that gives you free ammo, even on heat weapons, extra burst potential, AND heals green health on a relatively low cooldown is considered weak…

I think you’re sleeping on this talent hard, try taking it with Moonbow and pay attention to how much extra mileage you get out of it. It’s definitely a strong talent, but like appropriately strong not overpowered like other aspects of her kit.


The staff doesnt do much damage or build much overcharge on normal shots, moonbow…1 shot? Sure one extra shot is nice but it doesnt make much of a differene between 5 and 6.

Green health? 10 procs take 80 seconds to get 30 health which is less than a nasty hit from a clanrat…

Why would i ever use moonbow? Only reason to use it is because its overpowered but she has builds that let other weapons be stronger…

No, but it lets you lock an extra enemy off the ground for free, and to do so under very high pressure situations where venting is difficult.

Moonbow is still absolutely ridiculous on her, it’s an overpowered weapon on an overpowered career. Javelins are fine, but they’re not overpowered by themselves, and a huge amount of her builds with them is just her being OP.

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It is overpowered, and I will be extremely surprised if there’s any weapon that competes with it. Javelins almost certainly do not. Staff admittedly offers something no other ranged weapon does but even there Pale Queen is very good.

Regardless we’re clearly not going to agree on this, so you’re welcome to go on ignoring a really good talent, I’ve said my piece on it. It’s a really really good talent.

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I don’t see it. It’s a poor version of Blessed Combat + SA (hell even just SA is better). You could vent or reload + generate thp in those 8 seconds. It’s slightly better than Prized Bounty. It’s passive. The hp is certainly irrelevant on SoTT. The fee shot is irrelevant if headshotting with Javelin or the non-Moonfire bows. That means it’s only good because the staff is a silly stagger stick that completely ignores game mechanics and the Moonfire Bow is broken.

This talent is a missed opportunity because of its fixed nature. It’s inherently less interesting and fun than something like the old version of OE’s 3 talent on row 2, even if it’s stronger.

It would be great on a variety of careers that struggle with thp generation, but SoTT doesn’t outside of true solo.

I don’t think this matters much outside of Dwonsc3plus, and is only valuable because the Deepwood Staff is just silly.

I think it’s useful in some twitch stuff and vs pats, but yeah it’s definitely much more consistently useful in higher end modded where you can just completely ignore deathwish and bring mixed hordes down to a super manageable level.
Moonbow is gonna be stronger most of the time, and crits are better for any other build (arguably for moonbow too, assuming crits do anything for it).

Yes moonbow is broken but it does exist and Pale Queen does quite a lot for both its sustain as well as burst potential. Honestly this ain’t gonna be the hill I die on though so I’m done arguing about this talent. However I really do think it speaks volumes about the current state of SotT and the game generally this this talent could be considered one of the more lacklustre.


Yes SoTT is op. That doesn’t mean SoTT doesn’t have boring but op talents. I think it’s a fundamentally flawed talent that rewards passive play, with no room for skillful play. I would consider a simple 20% dodge range talent superior to all but the crit talent on that row (the crit one is op).

Contrast this with Repel, which rewards skillful play through precise timing and stamina management. It is far less fixed, since a good player that manages their stamina well will have Repel more often than one that doesn’t, especially under pressure. This talent can be hard to work with but has impact. That’s good design in my view.

Dodge range is in a similar boat as Repel. A player can do well with it, or poorly. Job Well Done rewards a player that is actively killing elites. Blade Barrier rewards good Paced Strikes uptime (which means frontlining as Merc). Barge rewards a keen understanding of spacing. The Pale Queen’s Choosing rewards existing.

Maybe that’s fine. I suppose not everything needs to have a high skill ceiling. I think it’s boring and limiting though.

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That’s a fair perspective and I completely respect it, though I do think it’s a bit of an exaggeration. Is managing an 8 second cooldown skill intensive? No but it does add another layer, albeit it a shallow one to your overall class management. I agree more active skills are more interesting but it does add another factor to consider when managing overheat/javelin count.

I also agree repel is one of her better designed talents. I appreciate Pale Queen for giving an ammo sustain talent which has a non simple impact on your overall dps and ammo sustain. That’s a bias from particularly enjoying the build crafting aspect of the game. But again I agree it adds little gameplay complexity in practice.

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Man here I was thinking 3 hp per 8 seconds is the strongest passive healing in the game. Stronger than amaranth, stronger still because of the passive 25% boost to healing received, stronger still with boon of shallya (30%). Seems like it works out to like 4 - 4.5 hp per 8 seconds depending.

With 40 hp every 80 seconds, and games lasting around 15 minutes, you’re looking at 450 healing over a match with 112 free shots on top of your own temp hp and temp hp from allies.

Even if you only have 50 percent uptime, you get 225 hp in a round and 56 free shots.

Natural bond gets you, what, 180 health and no self green heal, amoranth only gets you to 50% and provides no free ammo.

It’s pretty darn good IMO!

Edit: also stacking it with natural bond gives you great sustain. Stacking with boon of shallya does too with the other added benefits BoS provides. Stacked with natural bond you are looking at a theoretical max of 0.71 hp per second.

And I don’t know about you guys, but I usually don’t take more than 10-15 hits in a game. With temp hp included you could probably go through a fairly mistake-heavy game with no healing item usage

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Green health is most of the time useless because of it only healing thp, that’s why nb is so bad.

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