Simple System to Help Unlucky Players with Reds

Create a new variable to players server-side and set it to 0.

Everytime a player is allowed to get a red item but he doesn’t get it, raise this variable by the chance. For example if there is 1.6% chance to get a red, and the player doesn’t get it raise the variable by 1.6.

When this variable gets higher than a limit (for example 100, 125 or 150), he should get a red item without rolling.

Anytime the player gets a red from any source, set the variable to 0.

Profit. = Reduced number of topics with angry comments about the loot system.

This system would occupy less space on the server than an array for real pseudo numbers from 1-1000 to cover decimals.

When someone always use x weapon but he gets only red z, w, and y.

When opening a chest with a chance to get reds, send the server the id of the weapons the current hero holds in both slots IF he doesn’t have at least 2 copies of reds of them in his inventory (separately). And when these are standard, non-DLC weapons.
OR use your own stats about the weapons the player uses.

When there is a chance to get red weapons, give 5% extra chance per weapon for the used ones.
This might be an extra roll before the standard system or can be incorporated to the current loot system.
It wouldn’t guarantee the chosen types but they would get some advantages.

Profit

9 Likes

Same thing for hats !

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On a greater scale (say, >100 boxes) this system would only really reduce the spread of reds dropped (and maybe increase the overall droprate depending on probabilities chosen). But I don’t really feel the overall droprate is that bad, and as said: over a longer period of time this system only reduces spread, which doesn’t really matter for the bottom line.

It being inconsistent whether you get your first couple of reds after only a few hours or after several days / weeks of playing is indeed a problem for newer players, so your idea might actually not be that bad to solve that, if FS keeps insisting items need to be distributed by RNG (which I think is a bad idea in the first place). But eventually every player will have all the gear / dust to make the loadout they want at some point of time, with or without your pseudo-random distribution idea.

Another problem that happens then, is that the current system - even though it lets you have all the items you need stat-wise in a generally reasonable time - doesn’t give you any way to work towards the item illusions you want. You could play this game at a decent level for literally thousands of hours, and the chance you are unlucky and still don’t get that specific weapon skin you want is actually very realistic. This causes a lot of frustration as well.

You propose a system that increases the chances for reds of items you already had equipped, to mitigate such a problem I guess. That is nice for new players, but it’s a rather opaque system to allow targeted item farming somewhat, and since Vermintide’s mechanics aren’t really explained properly anywhere, it’ll only lead to frustration as players get yet another sword without understanding why, while they actually want a mace, but yeah, that hasn’t dropped yet so their best weapon remains the sword.

I think both the systems for reds stat-wise and illusion-wise could do with a lot less RNG. Ideal fix fir me would be something like the Athanor for crafting, and the illusions in Lohner’s Emporium and / or a system that weighs the dropchance towards the illusions you don’t have yet, sorta like the one you proposed for red dropchance.

But I think this topic isn’t really fitting for this BBB, and FS has implied they might be working on a rework for the item system, which probably means they won’t do bandaid fixes in the meantime.

2 Likes

Yes pls, and make it retroactive to a year ago too.

1100 hours and I still don’t have a shiny blue elf longbow :frowning:
Or dwarf hammer.
Or halberd.
Or kruber hammer.
Or…
yeah.

Come frikken on. Stupid game.

2 Likes

Have you calculated what the overall droprate would be in your case? Because I don’t see any real reason for it to suddenly change as it would be unfair to all existing players. Also I don’t see any real reason why anyone actually needs veteran items.

Unfair how? because they were more lucky than other players? that’s absolutely ridiculous.

It’t not even something you get for doing a challenge and then that challenge gets nerfed, is simple and pure luck, god forbid we actually can reduce the ridiculous grindfest that’s getting red items.

Why anyone needs them? well, because they are the only loot objective in a game that rewards loot on every single completed mission and sometimes even on failed missions, some builds can only reach breakpoints with maxed stats, and gl getting maxed stats on oranges.

By your logic, why would anyone need oranges? or blues, I’m 100% sure you can find people in this very forum that can do cata with greens as long as they are 300 power, probably even less power is fine too, if they can, so can anyone else.

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They should just replace the whole weapon ‘upgrade’ system with the Athanor system from the weaves. The Athanor is actually rational. You can upgrade exactly the weapon you want with the exact stats you want and can figure out how long (how many wins) it takes to get a red tier/power 300 item.

The only thing that should fall from loot boxes is weapon skins (and hats from commendation chests). But chests should be tweaked to be like Bogenhafen chests - you never get duplicate skins. You should get a “random” skin for whichever character you open the box as. The loot boxes should be rarer. You could purchase them with essence; or, if you don’t give a damn about cosmetics, you can spend all your essence on weapon upgrades and forget about skins altogether. Fatshark would just need to figure out the cost of upgrading weapons and purchasing skin loot boxes. If it took 50-100 hours to get everything on a single character, I think this would be fair and make “completing” all characters still only attainable for the most hardcore players. It would require time commitment but would be way less grindy and way less frustrating than the existing system because most of the RNG has been removed.

I have all reds on all characters and all red skins. To get all the skins took ~ 2.3K hours. The whole experience was pointlessly grindy. The last weapon skin I needed was a 1H hammer skin. I kept openning all my loot as Bardin to get it. Once I started focusing on the 1H hammer I got 126 duplicate red items before it dropped. Does anyone find this RNG BS engaging? Pointless grind does not make Vermintide 2 more fun. I enjoy the game way more now that I don’t give a damn about loot (I actually never cared about skins much anyway).

It’d be easy to switch systems so that new player don’t have to suffer all the RNG crap. Existing players can just be rewarded essence for all the weapons and dust they already own and keep all the skins they have already acquired. Existing players would lose nothing. Most of them would actually gain because it’ll be easier to get the red tier weapons and skins they don’t own. As a player that has everything that can dropfrom loot boxes, I’d be happy that new players have a more rationale path to ‘completion’ as long as it requires a substantial time investment (250-500 hours, not thousands).

P.S. Character/class upgrades should still be XP-based not essence-based. You actually have to play a character to get to level 35.

5 Likes

I know athanor system is better but I doubt FS would implement a very similar one to the regular game.

Illusions can be solved simply by making them available at Lohner’s shop. With the restriction you may apply them ONLY for red items.

My bigger issue is not the amount of reds that drop (i have enough of those already), rather trying to farm the specific one or the specific illusion that is problematic.
My elf is something like 30+300 range in levels and i am still missing stuff such as S&D illusion. I seriously don’t need that hagbane illusion for the 100th time.

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That’s also a good idea.

Let’s hope Fatshark see sense and make the Darktide loot system rational and not RNG-based.

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So basically, do what they’ve done for critical strike chance.

I wouldn’t mind a pity system like this. Question is would it be per gear acquired or chest opened.

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The entire system on how you get illusions and commendation cosmetics (cosmetics prob already are) is outdated. They should add it to LE and make normal skins cost around 5-15 shillings or something so it lines up with daily quests and make red illusions cost 50 shillings. I don’t mind them being obtainable by both, such as Le and chests aswell.

I can’t really give my opinion on getting dust and using it to reroll orange items as it has been a long time. If i Remember correctly i didn’t have any issues running out of dust when i started playing to reroll the occasianal trait or property ( and this was when you still could roll dupes), but maybe i got lucky. So i would say getting dust (green blue orange) is pretty fast and easy to get.

I also think red items is more of a psychological thing, where players think they need it to perform good, which is wrong (ofcourse certain builds need max %). I have no idea how to fix that, maybe by giving players more clarity on bp’s etc, better ways to test inside the keep?

But personally i don’t think red items are the issue in the current system, but more the illusion part and maybe the time it takes to reroll = which makes players collect multiple of the same red weapon, just to be able to switch on the fly = which in turn increases red item grind.

Also adding a pseudo system to red items wouldn’t really fix the issue of illusions i think? If it gets tied to illusions it could help the more unlucky players, but only the ones who get unlucky from the day it gets introduced. So i would rather see illusions and stuff fixed and make them obtainable by other sources, such as LE

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The only dust I missed was the green one. But they added the recipe so it’s okay.

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I just would like to have more chance to get weapons that i still dont’t have i’m missing bardin greataxe but i have 3 warpiks 3 axes 3 axes and shield ecc…

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You probably know this, but incase you don’t.
You can scrap the duplicate red weapons for dust, 5 red weapons = 1 you can choose.

Thanks yeah of course i know but i want the illusion :sweat_smile:

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It’s okay, after 4000h you’ll get them all !

Since my question got a troll instead of an answer, I’ll change it to another one: @Zoli, do you think the overall chance of getting a veteran item should remain the same? If no (as per your original description), what do you propose to do with all the chests that has already been opened by all the players?

I appreciate you calling me a troll for giving you an answer you didn’t like, and specially doing so without even mentioning me, very kind of you.

I’m sorry you wouldn’t feel as “elite” if more people could get reds easier, again, is simply luck, you didn’t do anything special to get them, nor are entitled to those items more than anyone else that wasn’t as lucky.

Which was?..

ADDED: Really, I re-read your reply to see if you’d edited it since then, and still didn’t find the answer to my question (which was directed at the OP anyway). The rest of what you write is purely your own assumptions and projections. Sorry, but you do seem to be trolling seeing how you brought nothing really useful to the discussion.

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