Moonfire is just overpowered in the sense it single handedly obsoletes every weapon option on Shade/Handmaiden without any other consideration for some niche situation to ever consider bringing the other weapons.
Longbow still does its job better than moonfire. But moonfire does hagsbane’s job far better on shade/hm. There is still an issue that there is no real reason to use swift bow. That bow ideally should just be given some identity to set itself apart from the other weapons.
No it does not, bow are used for killing specials but MB doesnt need to aim well and it shoots faster in a pinch because of it. You also do not have to worry about ammo at all.
As for the other weapons, they were never even an option on shade/hm at this point given damage for ammo spent&special killing speed problems.
Which elf melee weapon aside from SnD is arguably overpowered tho? That one is a bit too good at everything for how versatile it is but the rest all have weaknesses. Dual swords&armor, spear&being a worse SnD at the profit of a bit more reach.
As for the ranged ones, on waystalker longbow and hagbane are still better in proficient hands compared to moonbow, swiftbow remains barely decent thanks to the bleed but that´d be it.
On HM&shade moonbow’s silly overpowered compared to the other options because they are just comparing it with longbow which fires slower(needs to aim), needs ammo and is less versatile. Other bows are hardly even an option.
Volley would be good on shade but she lacks ammo sustain that is enough while the contraption drains a ton which is noticeable with a team that also lacks sustain or in a mode with a lot of specials.
This is why moonbow is so popular - you don’t have to be proficient with it to get the same results.
Same result isnt really the right description, hagbane and longbow both outperform moonbow when used well on waystalker.
But indeed, if not performing optimally/ being lazy then you get a better reward with moonbow for a similar effort compared to the others.
Good night everybody! lol
If you followed the conversation properly you´d have the context that i was specifically talking about waystalker when i said hag/long are better, and that MB is indeed much better on shade/HM generally.
But nah, be lazy.
Frosty is not wrong either, on HM and Shade Moonbow has the advantage of being powerful and not having ammo replenishment problems like Hag does on them. On WS with Moonbow, sure you can take the talent that lets you fire two arrows in one go and it frees up some talent choices, but LB and Hag anyway have infinite ammo on WS thanks to her ult ammo talent.
Moonbow is an upgrade over Hagbane off WS. I still like LB a bit better when you need to take out a lot of specials and elites in a much narrower timeframe, but outside that MB is a lot easier to use and doesn’t run out of ammo. Also the DoT damage on uncharged arrows is ridiculous.
Calling it an upgrade is a fun way of saying its a usable version : P
Hagbane is bad given on both those careers given they cant replenish the ammo well enough.
Thats about the one time you´d really want longbow over MB even on shade/HM, when you for some reason need to snipe a lot. But given that that usually doesnt occur outside certain gamemodes i do think it´s safe to say that MB is better on those careers generally.
Bloodfetcher got nerfed specifically to kill the hagbane abuse, successfully to the point where it seems to have killed the use entirely as far as i can tell.
I honestly find it hard to even trigger the lockout on those careers, i mean, how many specials will spawn at the same time that you need to shoot yourself? I ran through convo once and i shot like 2 or something before proceeding to maul some elites before the next special wave came in. At which point the bow was fully charged again.
I normally do not shoot elites on melee careers as i build to be able to handle em, so going like that i find it very sufficient for any anti special needs below the special modes.
Waystalker keeps the swift bow down too so its not like we’re not used to dealing with only one choice. It’s just easier to pass up the headshot ammo requirement (since the potential range crit with Shade that was very out of theme is gone). It also does good boss damage because it has DoT. There just isn’t much reason to not use it, unless you actually care about whiffing huge chunks of your teammates’ health away which the majority of QP elves would disagree with. Even just having unlimited ammo and not being joke tier like the drakefire pistols is massive on its own, but it works the entire enemy list over instead of having a weakness vs something.
I see two cases where LB is better than MB. First is when you are a Waystalker who is a dedicated special killer, with GK and Slayer on your team at the same time. Second is when you are playing 200% Twitch, and again, you are a Waystalker.
In every other occasions MB has more than sufficient energy pool to outperform LB, unless it’s overused against hordes.
It is overtuned, at least on HM and Shade for sure.
I think a reduction of the damage (base + DoT) is additionally very useful, but in return, in my opinion, the talents of the individual classes should also have an effect on the bow, i.e. that + ammunition increases the amount of available energy and + ammunition regeneration increases the charging speed of the bow. In addition to the damage debuff (I don’t think that a weapon with AoE damage should 1-shot all specials) you could think about giving the arrows more penetration against infantry, so that they explode only at the 2nd or 3rd enemy. That would perhaps put the focus more on the waveclear.
Yeah longbow does perform better if you have the space to shoot a lot of targets and the need to do so. But how often does that occur?
Shooting 5 times while in melee is already a lot, going above that isnt normal, that be a niche situation.
Lets look at everything Moonbow has…
1 shot body shot every special on cata (this is absolutely insane btw)
No range falloff (all the damage you care about is the dot)
Fireball like aoe on full charge with extremely overtuned dot (melting patrols)
Can kill hooks/assas inside hordes with the aoe on fullcharge
Requires basically no charge to 1 shot bodyshot specials on cata (shot comes out instantly - no downtime - you basically hold charge and shoot instantly without waiting for anything)
Infinite ammo and a fast recharge on the energy pool - fire and forget at max energy pool constantly
Very respectable energy pool - 6 uncharged - 5 minimal charge (to kill specials) - 4 fullcharge shots
Very respectable burst on bosses by just spamming thru all your energy in a very small time window
Powerbonus trait on bow with no downside (Barrage or on crit whichever you prefer)
Due to the absurd damage the weapon works with no power vs. requirement on cata (free to pick anything on charm/trinket or whatever its called)
This weapon is basically bolt staff + fireball staff in 1 but with significantly reduced charge time and better automatic energy generation but without the possibility to vent. Its beyond broken and it requires absolutely 0 skill.
The only minute downside this weapon has is that sometimes you need specials to die right now and not 1 second later - in that case you can just fire 2 uncharged shots to solve the problem.
Suggested nerfs:
/fixed.