# Mod support? Trepidation
**URL:** https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/mod-support-trepidation/25922
**Category:** Mod Discussion
**Created:** [July 20, 2018, 4:02pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/mod-support-trepidation/25922 "2018-07-20T16:02:02Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 2
### Author:  [@zaygr](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/zaygr)
#### Post date: [July 21, 2018, 12:31pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/mod-support-trepidation/25922/21 "2018-07-21T12:31:32Z")
It’s also nothing different to the minute, minute percentage of hosts who will kick you for not meeting certain breakpoints when joining their game.
While I am not overly optimistic (anyone remember that post that says they are now doing rigorous code inspection before rolling out patches) that all will be well, their stated plan for sanctioned mods where it looks like you can enhance your own experience without affecting the game over, or other players seems to be a good one.
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### Author:  [@Argonaut14](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/Argonaut14)
#### Post date: [July 21, 2018, 12:33pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/mod-support-trepidation/25922/22 "2018-07-21T12:33:25Z")
Just leave me completely unaffected and not disadvantaged in any way and I have no problem with mods. I, like you, remember them saying they would review all code and patches before releasing them and the very next patch broke something badly.
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### Author:  [@madminer95](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/madminer95)
#### Post date: [July 21, 2018, 12:34pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/mod-support-trepidation/25922/23 "2018-07-21T12:34:00Z")
there may well be a slightly rocky start, but that’s why they’ve said there starting with some of the very simple mods in the first wave, so they can work out any problems before they are really problems
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### Author:  [@Arrevax](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/Arrevax)
#### Post date: [July 21, 2018, 1:47pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/mod-support-trepidation/25922/24 "2018-07-21T13:47:58Z")
Simply host the game. Play with friends who don’t use the mods. Play alone, with bots (possibly just improved bots, if those aren’t a problem to you). I don’t know if a host having mods will necessarily force all of their features on you (ex: improved UI). Only a fraction of players will bother with mods, though that portion will probably end up lasting longer than vanilla players, meaning it’ll become a larger part of the long-term player base.
Your complaints sound like you’re just afraid of change, in some ways. Many mods will be simple improvements to things that Fatshark might not ever fix (ex: bad bots, UI not reflecting team-affecting traits like Natural Bond, etc.). A character voice lines mod would probably just enable lines that Fatshark hasn’t enabled or fixed. Many mod features may eventually be part of the vanilla game— are you bothered when Fatshark patches the game?
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### Author:  [@SmokerT69](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/SmokerT69)
#### Post date: [July 21, 2018, 3:02pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/mod-support-trepidation/25922/25 "2018-07-21T15:02:36Z")
There are mods people are going to be expected to have…
Let’s be honest, a small percent of the community is borderline mentally challenged as it is. I’ve actually been kicked from a party because I took the “weak hagbane”, instead of the “strong longbow” that can hit breakpoints. People are going to kick people for not having mods. People kick people for even stupider reasons now.
I was playing a game yesterday, joined in and both players were down, bot Kerillian was tanking the boss. Ress’d the two players and the bot finished off the boss. The BH player then proceeded to execute the bot with his xbow for “stealing his kill” just as another player was joining. So now we were down a player for a good portion of the map. The player who joined in asked why after he got resurrected. The BH and Bardin Ranger then killed him again and kicked him. GG
So yea, there’s already a lot of winners in this game.
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### Author:  [@Wuldias](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/Wuldias)
#### Post date: [July 21, 2018, 5:54pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/mod-support-trepidation/25922/26 "2018-07-21T17:54:09Z")
I need to ask, how does a mod that gives me:
A.)stats, aka I know I just survived with 2 hp instead of a tiny sliver.
B.) Ui change, what if I want a more gritty warhammerthemed healthbar with red health instead of green give me an advantage over you in the game?
If I never mention it, you will literally never find out. 🙂
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### Author:  [@lunethex](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/lunethex)
#### Post date: [July 21, 2018, 6:09pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/mod-support-trepidation/25922/27 "2018-07-21T18:09:53Z")
> [@ScrappyCocco](#):
>
> You don’t have to have faith, this is true, only mods that don’t give advantage will be sanctioned
It’s really silly for you to say that _as long as the mod doesn’t give an advantage it will be sanctioned_, by the way. Mods are already a serious advantage because they aren’t the base, vanilla experience. The lamentable, demonstrably inferior default experience that Fatshark is proud to call their ‘design philosophy’ at any rate.
It’s a modified experience, therefore a better one, and as a result is quite an advantageous one.
But let’s be real here, it’s not important.
> Finally, content that Fatshark should have had Day 1 may make it into the game - content they should have implemented themselves officially. Congratulations to all the people who made the mods in V1 then had to port them over and sit on them for 3 months. Which is every mod that stands to get sanctioned anyway.
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### Author:  [@lunethex](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/lunethex)
#### Post date: [July 21, 2018, 6:16pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/mod-support-trepidation/25922/28 "2018-07-21T18:16:24Z")
If you can’t figure out why nobody cares about mod support and why these forums and the discord are, in essence, potemkin villages, then you can’t be helped. The mod support in V2 is one of the most “shot myself in the foot” efforts in the last 5 years of gaming.
Why have Fatshark gone to all this trouble to ruin their game and act like we have any features to be proud of?
> [@SmokerT69](#):
>
> There are mods people are going to be expected to have…
If nobody can see the issue in this statement, then again, you just can’t be helped.
Why even bother with mod support when they had months to put the functionality in as standard? They clearly don’t care about making the game fun right now, nor did they even care about making the mod realm fun. Nobody plays it, and nobody _will_ play it because progression was locked.
It’s a pretty asinine situation all told.
Before you even jump on the ‘but deathwish, mutators’, I’ll save you the effort of typing it. That’s a good way to completely ignore the awful state of game balance and design. And to also be ignorant of who is even left playing the game now.
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### Author:  [@Argonaut14](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/Argonaut14)
#### Post date: [July 21, 2018, 7:03pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/mod-support-trepidation/25922/29 "2018-07-21T19:03:47Z")
@Wuldias the examples you give are the kind of mods I have no problem with.
> [@Arrevax](#):
>
> Simply host the game. Play with friends who don’t use the mods. Play alone, with bots (possibly just improved bots, if those aren’t a problem to you).
All of this is a problem to me. Hosting might be problematic ( i have already discussed why) and the feeling that I either need to play only with friends or play on my own suggests I am somehow being forced out because I don’t want mods. This divides a community already rapidly diminishing.
@lunethex has made quite a good point in that it’s likely just a smokescreen for the fact the game is so broken. Mod support isn’t going to fix the broken RNG or broken Duplicates etc. Yo uaren’t going to get a ton of hats all of a sudden because Mod SUpport.
I’m not afraid of change, but I can see people hoping mods will fix all their woes, but actually mod support will just add to the problems if not done absolutely right.
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### Author:  [@Darth\_Angeal](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/Darth_Angeal)
#### Post date: [July 21, 2018, 7:47pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/mod-support-trepidation/25922/30 "2018-07-21T19:47:40Z")
I can feel your thoughts. I have no problem with mods on the mod realm, but not on the official.
Even Waypoints or “better” Bots are just strong Mods and shouldn´t exist on the official one.
I don´t care if someone feels better then or it really helps them. I just don´t want the original game being affected.
Just let FS take care for our Feedbacks and fix / upgrade this game for all together.
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### Author:  [@Winthiefow](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/Winthiefow)
#### Post date: [July 21, 2018, 11:49pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/mod-support-trepidation/25922/31 "2018-07-21T23:49:05Z")
Just to answer the “Waypoint” exemple.
I haven’t read it all so maybe it was answered, but I think I’ve read somewhere before VT2 was released that their modding system should be able to “share” some stuff.
So it MIGHT work like this : Host got Waypoint, you join Host, Vermintide download and use Waypoint for the game duration.
But again it was before VT2 was released, and we already saw same delay, so this might be delayed too (and actually maybe dependant on dedicated server depending on how they implement it)
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### Author:  [@puntit](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/puntit)
#### Post date: [July 22, 2018, 7:55am UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/mod-support-trepidation/25922/32 "2018-07-22T07:55:23Z")
> [@Argonaut14](#):
>
> I’m not bothered about getting the in-depth stats of all of the possible weapons combinations to be able to min-max my character…
> I really really want to keep the official realm as a level playing field but I have a nasty ominous feeling that people who use sanctioned mods will have a varying degree of “being better”
You aren’t making a consistent argument. The in-depth stats have already been mined and people have built spreadsheets for breakpoints and stuff. Methods and builds that really make a meaningful difference when playing on Legend and deeds. If you’re not interested in doing the math and rolling for breakpoints and being the best you can be, that’s fine. But then you’re worried about not being as good as people with mods, due to whatever additional info or ui stuff might give someone using mods some sort of direct or indirect advantage over you.
Someone who has looked up and built for breakpoints is already having an advantage over you clearing stuff. Someone who has +20% power vs infantry with Handgun so they can one shot every special is gonna outperform someone using a Handgun without that breakpoint who has to either headshot or shoot twice. I doubt there will be many sanctioned mods that give a bigger benefit than knowing that simple fact. And I doubt there’s many people getting kicked for not having that breakpoint on their Handgun currently, so you’re worrying about nothing.
We’re not talking about using performance enhancing drugs at the olympics here, we’re talking about having a better heads up display. And there are probably a number of people you’ve run with in game who actually are using PEDs and aren’t demanding you use them or anything.
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### Author:  [@Argonaut14](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/Argonaut14)
#### Post date: [July 22, 2018, 10:02am UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/mod-support-trepidation/25922/33 "2018-07-22T10:02:37Z")
You make a really good point here, and I do concede there are people who have _gone to the effort_ of mining the data and getting the best builds for the breakpoints and results they want who will outperform me.
Those limitations and benefits are in the base game though and are part of the planned(!) difficulty setting by Fatshark to be used in the official realm. **Everyone** is bound by those rules and can use the stats (+25% vs infantry or whatever) if they like as everyone is in exactly the same position.
> [@Winthiefow](#):
>
> So it MIGHT work like this : Host got Waypoint, you join Host, Vermintide download and use Waypoint for the game duration.
This is the worst kind of outcome for me and it’s unlikely to happen to be honest as constantly downloading/transferring information without the player clicking “I accept” is not good at all. You can’t just install mods against someone’s will unless it’s in the modded realm I suppose.
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### Author:  [@ScrappyCocco](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/ScrappyCocco)
#### Post date: [July 22, 2018, 2:51pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/mod-support-trepidation/25922/34 "2018-07-22T14:51:56Z")
> [@Argonaut14](#):
>
> You can’t just install mods against someone’s will unless it’s in the modded realm I suppose.
Yes i’m pretty sure you can, there are games that do it, i’m pretty sure that Chivarly have something like that.
Anyway **this is not how mods currently works in V2 and i’m pretty sure FS will not implement that.**
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### Author:  [@Argonaut14](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/Argonaut14)
#### Post date: [July 23, 2018, 3:45pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/mod-support-trepidation/25922/35 "2018-07-23T15:45:18Z")
11 mods implemented, I already revoked due to exploits.One causing crashes and lost loot. Brilliant. Fatsharks screening worked like a charm.
Several that change the base game to give slight advantages to those using mods.
Guess I’m playing in the modded realm whether I like it or not.
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### Author:  [@SmokerT69](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/SmokerT69)
#### Post date: [July 23, 2018, 4:00pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/mod-support-trepidation/25922/36 "2018-07-23T16:00:41Z")
> [@Argonaut14](#):
>
> 11 mods implemented, I already revoked due to exploits.One causing crashes and lost loot. Brilliant. Fatsharks screening worked like a charm.
>
> Several that change the base game to give slight advantages to those using mods.
>
> Guess I’m playing in the modded realm whether I like it or not.
Put in a bug report? I’m not having any issues? Can you be more specific?
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### Author:  [@Argonaut14](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/Argonaut14)
#### Post date: [July 23, 2018, 4:08pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/mod-support-trepidation/25922/37 "2018-07-23T16:08:34Z")
I haven’t used any mods, just reading through the people using some mods (one with visible reload) complaining about crashes and lost loot and the Inventory mod is the one with the exploit - gearing up classes that you haven’t unlocked yet. Waypoint mod is also seeing reports of crashing when the game is minimized but I accept that is quite rare.
Not exactly well screened and tested, and if this is an example of the kind of thing FS are happy to have in their official realm then all their effort to GET EVEN MORE BUGGY STUFF into the game is actually laughable. They could have spent time, you know, fixing their actual game. instead of pushing for mod support that isn’t actually well supported or screened and introduces loads more bugs.
So if I join a host who uses a mod in the official realm that has known crashes I’ve inherited their problems and get to restart my games a lot? Yay for mod support.
\
Could this game be any more of a slapstick comedy disaster?
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### Author:  [@anon73549677](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/anon73549677)
#### Post date: [July 23, 2018, 4:42pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/mod-support-trepidation/25922/38 "2018-07-23T16:42:15Z")
It is unreasonable to think that FS, even dedicating its entire team to the effort, can be expected to find every crazy edge case in one mod, let alone those introduced by multiple mods used in unison. But that’s OK, because they’re taking the exact right (in my opinion, if that needs to be said) tact towards this: they are working closely and constantly with the mod-makers themselves to identify and fix issues that arise.
There will be some hiccups - they’re unavoidable - but FS and the many many modders working to improve this game are on it.
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### Author:  [@Argonaut14](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/Argonaut14)
#### Post date: [July 23, 2018, 5:15pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/mod-support-trepidation/25922/39 "2018-07-23T17:15:28Z")
I am completely baffled how people think introducing new elements that cause **_more_** bugs and crashes is somehow doing the right thing towards fixing the game. Crashing to desktop is a little more than just a hiccup when it restarts clients who aren’t using mods.
They aren’t even fixing issues that arise with the base, unmodded code so to say they’re working closely to fix things with mods is a bit of a stretch. Could FS work closely on fixing the things that are broken in the first place and have been since beta?
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### Author:  [@anon73549677](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/anon73549677)
#### Post date: [July 23, 2018, 5:25pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/mod-support-trepidation/25922/40 "2018-07-23T17:25:54Z")
The added functionality possible with mods vastly outweighs the temporary inconvenience of a couple of crashes. As soon as I’m back from vacation, the crash in Waypoints will be investigated and fixed. What will be the problem after this week?
As for bugs in the core game, if you’re actually interested in the development of the game and make an effort to follow dev posts (a hassle, I know, with the various mediums of communication), you’d know that fixes are coming and have largely been delayed by July vacations (which, honestly, I think you’d have to be some kind of monster to deny the devs).
Just one fool’s opinion here, don’t mind me!
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