They stack multiplicatively, not additively. Also despite the wording the vets bonus applies to melee.
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Yes… but as you noticed yourself, it seems like is not supposed to.
It is a bug…
Which means that it is complete bogus to bring this up when talking about any kind of rebalancing of a class.
Edit: Tbh it is good that the resistance applies to melee as well. Otherwise, it would be very likely that one melee unit hits you (thanks to teammates usually not giving a crap about covering you), which deletes your toughness and results in you instantly getting killed by ranged fire.
Volley fire only refreshes on ranged kills anyway, so it is no problem, since it can not be abused to slay a bunch of designated targets in melee combat while keeping the ult and toughness damage resistance up.
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Oof. So so much wrong with this.
As pointed out above, no unwavering gives toughness damage reduction against everything. Actually everything that says “ranged toughness damage reduction” applies to everything, from what I’ve read the code doesn’t have any form of Toughness damage reduction that can differentiate the source. Yes, correct, that means the Psyker feat for toughness DR against ranged also applies to everything.
So firstly, benediction takes the coherency aura from 7 TO 15%, it doesn’t add 15% on top of what you already have. Secondly, all forms of DR are multiplicative, so actually it’s 0.5x0.85 = 0.425 damage taken, so 57.5% effective toughness damage reduction for stacking two feats, and realistically bloodletting, as well as dedicating a blessing on your weapon to shred in a lot of cases.
So yeah Zealot got their DR feat nerfed down to 50%, which was absolutely the right call, I was all for that and still am. Now it’s Vet’s turn. 50% is very fine for the amount of toughness as well as toughness regen options they have, they’ll be very fine, I promise.
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Hmm interesting. For a long while i had this “feeling” it might be this way but good to see it somewhat confirmed.
It would be OK if they got rid of the double tuff damage while sprinting for vets, the zealot has 50% sprint and immunity on dodge DR so the nerf hurt them less.
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I would argue that it is not such a minor cheat - I have it, but have disabled it - because it provides you with important tactical information, e.g. whether to kill the pox burster and hound with ranged or not.
Just don’t sprint into ranged fire without sliding? All classes won’t be hit by ranged attacks while dodging or sliding anyway. Or are we seriously suggesting taking double Toughness damage while sprinting is a real issue against melee enemies? The vast majority of attacks in the game won’t hit you while dodging so damage multipliers while you’re in dodge state seem awfully irrelevant to me.
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I just got hit by a sniper in the middle of a dodge in my last run. I don’t think it did any more or less damage than it usually would do.
If you get hit by a sniper mid dodge it’s usually the servers pooping themselves and yeah it doesn’t matter which class you’re playing that can happen.
You are comparing the toughness damage reduction for Zealot and Vetaran here, when you should not.
Why?
Zealot is an agile melee class. The toughness damage resistance can be kept up most of the time (when using a setup for it) and the zealot is able to slide and dodge around while at full fighting capability.
Veteran can only make use of the toughness damage resistance while the ult is up, which means only for a few seconds at a time, unless you keep shooting and killing designated targets (with a setup for it).
Shooting with most guns requires you to aim carefully while pretty much standing still (or moving around slowly) which means that enemies shooting back, will hit you much more likely.
Sliding and dodging both make the gun sway around like crazy, so it can not really be done while shooting.
Fighting ranged units with a gun, without constantly getting back into cover and waiting for toughness to regen, requires a high toughness damage resistance.
Reducing the damage resistance from 75% to 50% would double the incoming damage and would bring it in line to the damage resistance of a class that can constantly dodge, slide, block and does not rely on fighting ranged units at range.
Far too many people look at raw numbers on certain things and ask for a nerf after making a false comparison to other classes that work completely different.
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No the majority of the number stuff in that post was aimed at correcting the huge amount of errors in the post I was responding to. I make the judgement about unwavering from actually playing Vet with unwavering and just tanking ranged mobs with little thought or effort going pew pew. Just shoot elites and you’re usually regenning faster than things can deplete your toughness 
1200+ effective toughness go brrrrrrrr
I just don’t think it needs to be that easy, but obviously your mileage may vary on that. Yes I’m aware nerfing from 75% to 50% would mean going down to only 600+ effective toughness but honestly I think that’s perfectly reasonable. Could we even agree to 60%? Or do you genuinely think it’s just fine as is? Because that’s absolutely wild to me to be honest. Again, based on actually playing Vet, not number crunching.
Also I strongly question the suggestion that you can’t move or be evasive while shooting with well… most guns honestly. Like yeah it’s tricky with the bolter that’s kinda meant to be the downside of that gun but Autoguns and lasguns? Really? You’re saying you just gotta sit there like a turret with those guns? Says who?
I overall agree with what you wrote just wanted to add that there is the “rambo” vet build with braced/auto pistol where you run in and keep ult up with shooting at basic blobs. It would probably be pretty hurt by DR nerf. On one hand, it’s a pretty braindead build on the other hand if you want to run bleed nades with it reloads can become something you actively have to think about.
Then maybe the toughness regen from „Confirmed Kill“ is the problem here.
Especially considering that it stacks at least 6 times, applies not only to elites but also to specials, and also works in melee combat.
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Yes I agree that feat is kind of an issue, even not considering unwavering TBH, I think it’s easily the strongest toughness regen feat in the game. I don’t believe there even is a stack limit which is pretty wild considering they clearly show some intent to avoid stacking regen with Psyker’s essence harvest (duration resets but does not stack).
I have a feeling unwavering would still be a bit overtuned without it but I’m certainly open to the possibility my opinion of it is biased by confirmed kill.
I kinda agree with you on this one. Stacking the passive regen is pretty brutal. Running essence harvester with the psyker passive TDR is already super tanky and it doesn’t stack.
Even if the intent of this is for the Vet to jump on elites immediately (and that’s basically the main power of the class to deal with “priority targets”) that talent is overturned, especially on High-Int with the brutal elite density.
All you’re saying basically translates to me how incompetend Fatshark is,
description specifically mentions +15% PLUS and does not indicate a change in TDR of the passive at all, thats just a big L in wording.
wasn’t aware that’s the case, and yet again proves to me that either fatshark coder’s are incompetent at creating that distinction in the code, or the people who write the descriptions to the talents have no clue whats going on.
fair enough i assumed wrong, but i have to say that i absolutely despise when game devs do this, sure its so players don’t reach 100% dmr HOW ABOUT NEVER GIVING THE PLAYER THE TOOLS TO REACH THESE HIGH NUMBERS IN THE FIRST PLACE rant over
promise what you wan’t, i don’t care, i don’t use it, for all i care they can replace the talent in its entirety, imo Damage reduction shouldn’t exist in the first place or atleast player influenced damage reduction and damage should always be calculated with real relateable numbers.
TBH, no-one who ever played any of the VTs should be surprised by this one.
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in v2 they had missing information sure but i don’t recall talents be described to be literally wrong(unless not working), but then again i never read/watch grimmalack’s or Jsat stuff…
the servers were particularly poopy last night. People were dropping out of games and getting stuck. I was rubberbanding like crazy and getting stuck while doing weapon swaps and ads-ing. Just saying, it does happen occasionally even if it’s not supposed to.
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You describe someone who, for whatever emperor forlorn reason, did not choose counterfire.
With counterfire you wont drop out of Volley Fire unless you have a whole bunch of Vets in your team that are alot quicker than you, or if there is nothing worth shooting (, or if we got those “not range mob” range mobs). Staying in Volley Fire also fixes the suppression problem, since you are immune, and it fixes the “you need to aim carefully” problem, since all of the prominent range weapons, aka Bolter, XII, Agrip Infantry, most headhunter guns, will bodyoneshot range gents, and deal quickly with elites.
The Vets who take Unwavering Focus are the ones who give a fart about their team mates. Camo Expert makes you virtually immune to all and everything, putting your portion of the damage onto the other people on your team.
Unwavering Focus only ever is OP if there are enough Elites/Special to kill. Even in high Int Damnation runs you will run into massive range camps every once in a while that are void of elites. They hurt.
If you pick any other form of THP you are either back to having to pick your shots to regenerate, or to slowly gaining some over time.
That Unwavering is also granting the Vet 75% DR to melee attacks is obviously lunacy and should die asap. When that is done Confirmed Kill needs some touching. I wouldn’t change the ranged DR at all. That would just trample on the already beaten up remaining two toughness feats.
(We also shouldn’t forget about the “Ghost” Blessing. The XII is already the king of the hill.)