The DLCs have been a huge minus for the game overall but I had the exact same opinion in VT2. The DLC was badly balanced and designed to make you buy better weapons. How can anyone look at Bardin’s kit and not arrive at that conclusion, with the single exception of Handgun all of his best equip slot options are things you only get through purchase. However scum dodge talents are just absurd and should be swapped or toned down. How is going from 0.85s dodge recovery time to 0.51 not something that fundamentally breaks combat in the game?
Interesting POV.
holy shite those are mortis trials kill farming numbers
2 Likes
That can tank crusher overheads
3 Likes
I mean yes we have golden toughness, but it works as a secondary tool players use when there is not enough damage or they failed awarness.
Basicaly in DT:
-having high damage and being tanky (or rely on high mobility) is OP
-having high damage and not being tanky is ok
-being extremely tanky and having mid damage is absolute ass that has no value just turns game into a slog
Like the only scenario i remember where raw tanking was beneficial is Twins where ogryns were playing easy mode, and psyker’s low toughness pool was noticable cause of closed arena full of gas.
It is somewhat fine that the game leans towards damage builds (even tho i prefer zdps facetanking), but then glass cannon damage still should be tuned so there is an oportunity you will be shattered.
1 Like
Hive Scum is only OP on the Offensive side. The class survivability is on the Weak side for the average player, on the hands of a good player Survivability is fine.
For Havoc 40, you can’t really blow everything up with the Rockets, because there are just so many Elites. You will run out of rockets before you can kill all of them. So it’s only good for Emergency.
The only thing that is OP with the Rocket launcher right now is when you do the current new Event, where you get unlimited Rockets. This is why you go in Auric with this Event, all the Hive Scumbs are blowing things up.
3 Likes
The problem is when you have tools that blow up a pack of the strongest elites then the game needs to spawn even more of them to provide a challenge.
Wich just leads to a worse gameplay it’s impossible to read animations in that meatwaves, enemies loose identity cause every type is a horde enemy now, meta shifts towards high cleave/aoe even more. And your screen is polluted with more flames (both ally and enemy), explosions, etc.
DT feels more like a bad mmo/arpg now, you just need to overspamm endless meatwaves.
Like i already play PoE2 (and sometimes pay more attention for enemies there than in DT), i want DT to stay action game where muscle memory, timings and reaction means more than just spamming defensive and offensive tools in a simplistic loop.
7 Likes
True, but sadly this is where the game is headed. I dont think they will change this, and most of the new classes that are coming out will be just as OP
1 Like
Wait you see such a thing for the first time???
I had a Relay station run that was done in 16 minutes and the fu…and the Scum did over 1 mil
Disagree strongly. Hive scum skill floor is lower than other classes on actual difficult content because their avoidance is better. With the right build as pointed out they can also take quite a hit.
So even the average player, as low as that measurement is, still does significantly better on hive scum (no ammo management, best dodges, strong talents and weaponry) than on other classes. Only purge staff psyker is easier, probably (and on lower difficulties arbites)
You’re also downplaying the offenses a lot tbh. Even “just for emergencies” the boombringer is OP. You can deal with 4 emergencies between each grenade pickup. How many emergencies does the average havoc match have between every grenade refresh? How many emergencies does a single grenade pickup singlehandedly solve for literally any other class? This is on top of being able to kill most things better than other classes just with their default weapons.
3 Likes
Isn’t this a good thing? AVerage players can play the new class, which is what we needed. We don’t want the game to be so difficult that only 0.1% players can play and enjoy. You know what I mean?
And I’m glad that FS is going with this direction to make more new & average players can enjoy the game
I think it would be a good thing if the payoff wasn’t skewed. Low skill floor things are fine, but they shouldn’t outperform other high-skill/high-effort/late-learning curve things with such ease.
For a really basic example of this, it feels really bad to another player when he’s fighting 5 maulers and dodging them and hitting them with heavy attacks while avoiding specials, and the Hive Scum player can just hold down M1 on them and not only does he kill them completely risk free, he does it while not expending any limited resource, he does it faster and he can do the same thing for the specials too and the ranged enemies as well as the bosses and every horde.
In that way it kills off skill expression and devalues the payoff from learning the games fundamentals, which are probably the main drivers for continued gameplay interest and fun for players who put many hours into this game.
6 Likes
I would say, as always, that this game is totally broken
The users discuss about scums… But the truth is that:
- psykers are way too powerful for 3 years
- Veterans have gold toughness for 2 years
- DS nerf is waiting for… I don’t even remember
- Boltgun has been or too powerful (actual situation) or a crap
- Zealot have lot of crunches and a lot complained about the speed run builds with combat blade
- Arbitres are way too hard to be killed… the Director needs to launch a second army backing the first to get an arbitres killed
- DLC classes weapons are surely too strong
- Pickaxes are extremely powerful are can wipe everything
- Scums complains are focused about pickpocket… fact is, at the release Scums were fun to play, but they buffed them too much the survivability
And this list is clearly not complete.
At contrary, we have a lot of skills and weapons that are pure garbage. Just to quote: Catachan sword, combat shotguns, laser rifle etc.
The game is a mess. You talk about scums… but there is ton of things that Fatshark needs to nerf for ages!!! And at contrary, several that are totally useless.
6 Likes
Water is vet.
Yeap, except the initially “adaptation” period It’s extremely broken. People who were not familiar with the class mechanics, combined with options of certain ‘influencers “probably” didn’t help with the initially assessment. I found that really funny. Sure, if you allow to get yourself hit you pay for it, as a melee psyker does (well at least used to, these days you can tank even some overheads, unless you play Havoc), but damage output and survivability outside “bs moments” is insane.
Enemies cannot touch you because they are dead in a split of second, and your dodges & mobility are extremely forgiving. It’s Empathic Evasion with a key press. Oh, you made a mistake and REALLY placed yourself in a bad spot. No problem. Pull out Boom Bringer and screen clear with no punishment.
HS dodge stats / dodge refresh timer / time you are considered dodging are insanely high and provide lots of survivability, ESPECIALLY on its best mobile weapons like shivs. Shives are an unbalanced joke. Weapon wise, YET again knives in Darktide do more damage than 40k weapons. Maybe it’s time to stop with this knife fetish? On other hand Rampage and a lot of supporting talents can make majority of weapons “A+” tier.
Desperado HS is Inferno Psyker Lite. A good desperado HS makes games outside high Havoc "empty” before you even get to the enemies as a melee class. Similarly to inferno psyker the playstyle is extremely boring by itself. You barely need to aim or control your weapons. Just point at the general direction of the enemy.
Boom Bringer and Chem Nades are broken and remove any difficulty spikes in the game, especially BB. If it was up to me BOTH would not be big Area of Effect options. Chem Nades should have 2-3 meter radius max, do good monster damage, and apply enough DoTs to kill anything but a Crusher, leaving those with 10% HP or something. BB anti-armour rockets which blow up multiple Crushers and other elites should not exist at all. Make it single target, at BEST 1-2 meter radius with damage dropping on the outside perimeter. Both blitzes should have less ammo.
This general trend to allow players to blow up majority of enemies in one good hit has to stop. It removes the core combat from equation. The core combat is the reason why the game is engaging. You are losing the game identity, Fatshark, and I’m not convinced people high up understand that. It really feels like we are balancing the game around Havoc 40 instead of balancing Havoc 40 around the game. 
11 Likes
they should have just made the boom bringer 3 rockets by default like it was in the press build, there was literally no reason to do what they did. it just makes siloing into scum and them getting mad when you refill your fire grenades because HEY they could clear any tempo bump or challenge that comes up, 4 times potentially, if you just gave them all the grenades. and then the later nades too. just don’t use your blitz ever if scums are around because they have the most/best consumables.
and emphatic evasion wishes it was as good as these ones that let you just avoid enemies and pick more favorable ground with zero cost. I get such bad habits scumming for too many games in a row and then going back, suddenly I’m getting hit in buttslides and go ‘oh right they have that giant 5m hitbox extension when they’re behind you, that scum entirely avoids’.
2 Likes
Water’s not wet the same way fire isn’t burned.
It was 2… they have raised to 3 (stupid) and there is a talent that permits you to get one more…
And there is also a talent to use toxin with it (for what, who knows considering the giant amount of damage dealt by it - this talent is just for monstrosities and the flash bang grenades)
1 Like
it was 3 in the press build then 2 on release and then 3 turbo buffed nuke rockets a week later with the ‘hive scum isn’t powerful enough’ update. I think we should have tried just giving them 3 rockets if it needed buffs, the hyuge splash and damage buffs on top of that was too much.
6 Likes
yeah i posted some kill counts. especially this new event is point bazooka at the biggest clump of enemies and fire. the fact it can delete 10 crushers in one shot is ridiculous. if it’s a shaped charge it could kill one, maybe the next in line too. but for area of effect, ogryn’s bomb has more but only topples them. ok, i played the event as mindless fun, one can’t take something like that seriously.
same for the shivs. “improvised” my 
. why can’t the astra militarum improvise something like that? they’re arguably easier to use than the dreaded ds4, on par with arby’s stick imo.
tbh i like the glass cannon approach because it lets players who move and aim well shine. but the scrawny dude from the gutter just walks over crushers who can fit 3 guys his size inside their armor.
3 Likes