# If your engine and devs cannot handle it, don't implement shield enemies like Bulwark **URL:** \ **Category:** Gameplay Feedback\ **Created:** [December 22, 2023, 1:26pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/if-your-engine-and-devs-cannot-handle-it-dont-implement-shield-enemies-like-bulwark/89938 "2023-12-22T13:26:12Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 11\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![JanZamoysky](https://dub1.discourse-cdn.com/flex013/user_avatar/forums.fatsharkgames.com/janzamoysky/32/87926_2.png) [@JanZamoysky](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/JanZamoysky)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2023, 1:26pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/if-your-engine-and-devs-cannot-handle-it-dont-implement-shield-enemies-like-bulwark/89938/1 "2023-12-22T13:26:12Z")
I’m getting slightly tired of Bulwark patrols, especially in clutch situations: - Their shields just don’t work as they should, shields block attacks from angles the shield is NOT present - Unlike shield stormvermin, you cannot easily use stamina to stun Bulwarks, and in situations with multiple shield enemies that mechanics was also broken in VT2 - Attacks which shouldn’t often end up latching on to the shield anyway - Mob hyperdensity issues (another problem you never managed to address in Vermintide ) combined with multiple bulwarks makes for a fairly frustraiting experience where you cannot hit enemies “inside” the bulkwark hiitbox, yet they can hit you - Do not introduce shields if your mechanics to bypass / counter them break down in situations with multiple enemies / Bulkwarks - patrols of 6+ Bulkwarks isn’t good gameplay, it just an example of how undercooked game mechanics fall apart, even more so than facing 10+ elite gunners - Enemies who target other players are able to just walk through player hitbox, especially in narrow spaces. If those enemies for whatever reason switch aggro, you end up sandwitched by enemies who have no right to walk through your space in the first place. FIx: - hyperdensity - enemies ignoring players and other mobs when walking and attacking - shield hitboxes and their interactions vs attacks coming from different angles Most likely for future Tide games: fighting shield enemies effectively should not be weapon / class specific. ---
**Author:** ![Ragnarok101](https://dub1.discourse-cdn.com/flex013/user_avatar/forums.fatsharkgames.com/ragnarok101/32/78147_2.png) [@Ragnarok101](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/Ragnarok101)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2023, 1:28pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/if-your-engine-and-devs-cannot-handle-it-dont-implement-shield-enemies-like-bulwark/89938/2 "2023-12-22T13:28:11Z")
This is why krak grenades or plasma are nearly mandatory on vet. You need SOMETHING to counter these. ---
**Author:** ![JanZamoysky](https://dub1.discourse-cdn.com/flex013/user_avatar/forums.fatsharkgames.com/janzamoysky/32/87926_2.png) [@JanZamoysky](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/JanZamoysky)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2023, 1:32pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/if-your-engine-and-devs-cannot-handle-it-dont-implement-shield-enemies-like-bulwark/89938/3 "2023-12-22T13:32:34Z")
Right, let me make a note for everyone. This is NOT a request for “advice”, tactics, talents or weapon recommendations. None of those sadly resolve the underlying issues with shield enemies, hyperdensity and enemies ignoring players and each others mass. This is “gameplay” feedback. We have been here before with hyperdensity and undercooked shield enemies. More you introduce them in horde situations more they expose how those PvE interactions are undercooked and broken. Visual guide for rant-impaired: ![image](https://europe1.discourse-cdn.com/flex013/uploads/fatshark/original/3X/0/7/07c0d14e5487e77a6a4b9e2133465e5bf0606d98.png) ---
**Author:** ![Ragnarok101](https://dub1.discourse-cdn.com/flex013/user_avatar/forums.fatsharkgames.com/ragnarok101/32/78147_2.png) [@Ragnarok101](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/Ragnarok101)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2023, 1:40pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/if-your-engine-and-devs-cannot-handle-it-dont-implement-shield-enemies-like-bulwark/89938/4 "2023-12-22T13:40:12Z")
Oh yeah, this isn’t advice, it’s annoyance at having my builds pigeonholed. ---
**Author:** ![JanZamoysky](https://dub1.discourse-cdn.com/flex013/user_avatar/forums.fatsharkgames.com/janzamoysky/32/87926_2.png) [@JanZamoysky](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/JanZamoysky)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2023, 1:41pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/if-your-engine-and-devs-cannot-handle-it-dont-implement-shield-enemies-like-bulwark/89938/5 "2023-12-22T13:41:48Z")
> [@Ragnarok101](#): > > it’s annoyance at having my builds pigeonholed. Forever flail’ed 🤟 ---
**Author:** ![BigSneeze](https://dub1.discourse-cdn.com/flex013/user_avatar/forums.fatsharkgames.com/bigsneeze/32/70556_2.png) [@BigSneeze](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/BigSneeze)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2023, 4:53pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/if-your-engine-and-devs-cannot-handle-it-dont-implement-shield-enemies-like-bulwark/89938/6 "2023-12-23T16:53:40Z")
Such a deeply unintelligent post. You are probably some solo mentality player that finds Bulwarks too hard and you can not fathom using team work to dismantle a threat like this. FatShark, I have 1,400 hours in Vermintide 2 and 800 hours in Darktide, you did amazingly with the Bulwarks, they are really fun. I am sorry people like this play your games who can not understand the gameplay balance purposes of why you made the Bulwark shield block at full angles instead of exclusively only blocking shots that hit the shield. FYI OP, this game has different armor values at different parts of the enemies’ body, but yet you think the Bulwark blocking at wide angles is a game engine issue, that alone I hope has disqualified your post from being read by a dev. ---
**Author:** ![CommanderJ](https://dub1.discourse-cdn.com/flex013/user_avatar/forums.fatsharkgames.com/commanderj/32/13959_2.png) [@CommanderJ](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/CommanderJ)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2023, 6:58pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/if-your-engine-and-devs-cannot-handle-it-dont-implement-shield-enemies-like-bulwark/89938/7 "2023-12-23T18:58:07Z")
_Woooosh_ ---
**Author:** ![misto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/779978/32.png) [@misto](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/misto)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2023, 6:58pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/if-your-engine-and-devs-cannot-handle-it-dont-implement-shield-enemies-like-bulwark/89938/8 "2023-12-23T18:58:42Z")
be thankful that the enemies havent figured out how to make armor for all their guys out of whatever the bulwarks shield is made of YET ---
**Author:** ![LVSpooky](https://dub1.discourse-cdn.com/flex013/user_avatar/forums.fatsharkgames.com/lvspooky/32/94474_2.png) [@LVSpooky](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/LVSpooky)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2023, 7:02pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/if-your-engine-and-devs-cannot-handle-it-dont-implement-shield-enemies-like-bulwark/89938/9 "2023-12-23T19:02:40Z")
> [@BigSneeze](#): > > Such a deeply unintelligent post. You are probably some solo mentality player that finds Bulwarks too hard and you can not fathom using team work to dismantle a threat like this. Dude. The OP is clearly talking about major inconsistencies and issues with hit-boxes and enemy collision. Bulwark shield hitboxes are well known for being _far_ bigger and curved than their actual appearance should indicate. Enemies walking through other enemies or even players is also a known issue that throws sensibility out the window. I can understand enemies having a certain amount of overlap to be acceptable in a horde game, but directly inside each others’ center of mass?! > [@BigSneeze](#): > > I am sorry people like this play your games who can not understand the gameplay balance purposes of why you made the Bulwark shield block at full angles instead of exclusively only blocking shots that hit the shield. Instant counterpoint: They could have made the shield visual more closely match the hitbox. It’s the same issue as ragers having axes with hitboxes that would indicate and extra meter of length. Ghost hitboxes are ok if they are only a little bit off from the visual, but freaking _Skyrim_ has better hitboxes. > [@BigSneeze](#): > > FYI OP, this game has different armor values at different parts of the enemies’ body, but yet you think the Bulwark blocking at wide angles is a game engine issue, that alone I hope has disqualified your post from being read by a dev. You are aware that this post is talking about bullets hitting the shield hitbox rather than the armoured body hitbox, right? There was never a window for a dumb mistake like this. OP is clearly not talking about hitting a carapace shoulderplate for -90% damage. They are talking about shooting upwards of a meter around the shield visual and the shield hitbox absording the hit. ---
**Author:** ![Bubby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/cab0a1/32.png) [@Bubby](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/Bubby)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2023, 7:43pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/if-your-engine-and-devs-cannot-handle-it-dont-implement-shield-enemies-like-bulwark/89938/10 "2023-12-23T19:43:50Z")
I have no words… ---
**Author:** ![system](https://europe1.discourse-cdn.com/flex013/uploads/fatshark/original/3X/3/1/319a2f41b73f03a4d9360defbe43058888a33c8c.png) [@system](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/system)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2023, 7:44pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/if-your-engine-and-devs-cannot-handle-it-dont-implement-shield-enemies-like-bulwark/89938/11 "2023-12-30T19:44:34Z")
Closed on December 30, 2023, 7:44pm UTC This topic was automatically closed 7 days after the last reply. New replies are no longer allowed.