Hotfix 1.2.11

yes, just like me, look at this (me with friends)

when the nerfs really hits you, (and me), is when you are loosing, and you feel like you could have done better before

when i play with randoms i just loose games at a rate that is unacceptable for me, sucking its sucking and it sucks to suck, i’m not putting the blame on my team mates, even if they are randoms

what I really hate about the ‘‘its just fine’’ take, is that i tried surge staff without the bug, and it felt just fine to me, i could be a decent psyker with it anyways, but when i see the mains complaining it got so bad that its unusable then i see myself in them

if you don’t main the class you might never notice the nerfs, if you main the class you know how to be good despite the nerfs, but it still sucks that you had to make sacrifices that you didn’t want to do

i wouldn’t be doing this if patch 15 was a balance patch, but it was NOT meant to be a balance patch, this is what infuriates me

i didn’t say a pip in patch 13, i’ve even got my favorite weapons buffed in patch 14 (even though they buffed all wapons, except headhunter autoguns and ripper guns for whatever reason)

so i was confident patch 15 wouldn’t have been a diastrous balance patch, you see where my point is?


Well, you’re obviously cleaning up, but the real question is, were your scores better or worse prior to the patch(es)? The point I’m trying to make is not about my buddy’s absolute skill level, but rather that afaict he’s actually doing better since the patch!

either he is faking it, or he just havn’t played enough games to realize the situation

score wise i think i get pretty much the same, but since patch 13 i don’t believe the scoreboard represent doing good, especially for a vet class that has been degraded to a support class

many players that i see doing massive damage are hoarding for the scoreboard to the point they keep getting downed, getting downed is not ok for a veteran, there is no such thing as ‘‘veteran gaming’’, when i loose games i find myself to be the last one standing most of the times, i’m tanky, i’m used to be tanky, i can take 1k damage in a game and never get downed, well with -23 hp and less thoughness regen i can’t be a good vet anymore, i need to fall into the meme category of veteran gamers despite knowing how to build it proper

plasma gun is so strong that you can play with executioner’s (volley fire), but in the end its just a less versatile voidstrike staff that can shoot trough walls, nothing really OP if you play all classes like i do

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I don’t mean that he says he’s doing better – he’s complaining loudly about the nerfs like every other vet :grinning: – but rather that his scores are noticeably better. Surprised me tbh, since he’s been complaining about the nerfs

there are more enemies in the maps, with more enemies vets tend to do more on the scoreboard, when they do their damage (or at least I) is when their team mates doesn’t pump enough themselves

with surge boys out of the way bolter vets like myself become the anvil, and as of result they do more damage this patch, because there is more meat coming at them

the goal of the mission is to survive though, and vets are just failing at it, i think your friend feels the same way

but surely they don’t do more damage because of the keystones

so this is the fatshark deal: we nerf you all your good stuff, and add the keystones

pretty simple

i consider myself Lucky, my playstyle was revolving around killing bosses, so focus fire is the right keystone for me

but for most vets they don’t care about the boss fights, those are the ones who got really scammed this patch, they have just been robbed of their best perks and got nothing in return


I don’t expect to change your opinion, and as always I feel it must be said up front that the tree needs ~2 points of flexibility to feel better, but the damage and stagger you can do with Marksman’s Focus has brought me back to the Vraks7. Feels like quite a buff to me. And I’ve basically just stopped talking about revolver because all 3 keystones have made it downright mean.

i’m pretty sure i can do better with my C tier bolter, the vets complaint is that they don’t get survivability anmyore, in a class that already had little, damage was buffed for all weapons in patch 14, shovel and mg 1a has never been this strong, but i can’t play them anymore, not with these nerfs, now i’m stuck to my best build which is power sword and bolter, kraks are also good but they are not my thing i dont feel like they are sustainable

i’m a 800 vet, with me in the team its hardly a loss, well it sucks but i think i suck more now than before, i knew it as soon as i’ve discovered the changes (because they were not in the patch notes at the start), that it would suck

the new cinematic for me were all the nerfed vets dying to the scabs, was kinda funny untill i started playing my class for real

What was expected from them was to remove these


and just slap the keystone below

well they failed at this very simple task, they had to go trough a complete rebalance, for what

2-3 skill points to get more crit chanche, 2 skill points to get your botched boss damage back, 3 skillpoints to get more attack speed in melee?

if this works for you more power to you man, it means you are a better vet than me

i remember to everybody that this was not meant to be a balance patch, this was the patch when finally the vets would get his keystones and be happy, stronger, faster


All your other points aside, I feel it’s plainly impossible for keystones to be added without there being tree-wide changes.

they did in patch 13 for the other 3 classes, did any of those got nerfs?, i mean, psyker lost cerebral laceration, but thats it

its true that i main vet but i play all classes, i’ve got 2 zealots characters to farm melk


Maybe I’m confused or lost track of patch numbers, but trees (and therefore keystones for the other classes) didn’t exist before patch 13, right?

most of the abilities existed, if any of those got nerfed they wasn’t in order to add the keystones, or you think they nerfed holy revenant because of the keystones?

for god’s sake they even removed the reload on F from the vet and gave it to the Ogryn on his shooty shoot F

my topic ‘‘veteran nerfed to the ground’’ was meant to include patch 13 big nerfs, my vet still suffers from those, -100 thougness, no more reload on F and 60% thougness back, volley fire became a complete joke, i used to play full games never reloading my bolter, i just pressed F when i needed it, wasn’t even bothering doing the 30 rounds thingy either

and now this is gone from my builds


i never said a word on patch 13, i never thought vet deserved the nerfs but i’ve accepted it

but this time enough is enough


I honestly don’t know if certain talents that existed in the previous iteration of the talents system were nerfed, but many things just didn’t exist. There absolutely has been a holistic, measured and methodical approach to the trees across the board, and I mean to say that with such a huge addition as keystones, the whole tree would absolutely need to be tweaked.

I understand there were a lot of toughness-related nerfs. I think that was done very consciously, but that there are balancing tweaks needed (and fixes like Exhilarating Takedown). And then the point flexibility issue.

well i’ll tell you then, you can pretty much get all the old patch 12 feats with the new talent trees with all classes (but vet)

vets main things were 3

Sustained Fire, no extra damage but it reloads your weapon and get you 60% thougness back
Confirmed kill, 25% thougness + 25% over 10 seconds
Volley Adept, 30% reload speed on elite/specialist kill

they all gone

this is the new best thing vet has after patch 13 by the way


how does that feel

Oh and Kruber’s F, sorry forgot about that