# Havoc game mode - artificial difficulty **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [December 10, 2024, 3:54pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/havoc-game-mode-artificial-difficulty/103063 "2024-12-10T15:54:14Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![Cerebrophage](https://dub1.discourse-cdn.com/flex013/user_avatar/forums.fatsharkgames.com/cerebrophage/32/92210_2.png) [@Cerebrophage](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/Cerebrophage)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2024, 5:50pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/havoc-game-mode-artificial-difficulty/103063/122 "2024-12-11T17:50:11Z")
Maybe Havoc levels would’ve been better received if it was done in a horde mode wave-system that keeps your progress where-ever you fail, causing you to start 5 waves earlier from your highest clear so you can “get in the flow” of the ramp up in power? I think that’d be reasonable. ---
**Author:** ![Sno](https://dub1.discourse-cdn.com/flex013/user_avatar/forums.fatsharkgames.com/sno/32/105551_2.png) [@Sno](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/Sno)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2024, 7:18pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/havoc-game-mode-artificial-difficulty/103063/123 "2024-12-11T19:18:47Z")
> [@Jado](#): > > Although I am not even close to the 75%, let alone the 1% of players, I am flattered that you are including me in the same category as guys like Mr. Unc, Reginald, and ChocoB. What percentage of the population have the True Survivor or have cleared 30\40? If it is ~1-10% you are by the only objective measurement available one of the top players. I thought I saw a post of yours claiming these achievements sorry if I was mistaken. ---
**Author:** ![Jado](https://dub1.discourse-cdn.com/flex013/user_avatar/forums.fatsharkgames.com/jado/32/120644_2.png) [@Jado](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/Jado)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2024, 7:37pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/havoc-game-mode-artificial-difficulty/103063/124 "2024-12-11T19:37:19Z")
> [@Sno](#): > > What percentage of the population have the True Survivor or have cleared 30\40? If it is ~1-10% you are by the only objective measurement available one of the top players. I thought I saw a post of yours claiming these achievements sorry if I was mistaken. * * * Not sure; I have those, but I didn’t do it on my own. The entire squad (striketeam and pubs) pulled our weight, and we achieved our goal together. * * * ![Screenshot_20241211-204157_Brave](https://europe1.discourse-cdn.com/flex013/uploads/fatshark/original/3X/7/8/7889029d64af8794f927f687078d08b18fcbee51.jpeg) ---
**Author:** ![se05239](https://dub1.discourse-cdn.com/flex013/user_avatar/forums.fatsharkgames.com/se05239/32/115181_2.png) [@se05239](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/se05239)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2024, 7:38pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/havoc-game-mode-artificial-difficulty/103063/125 "2024-12-11T19:38:39Z")
Man, I hate how this game mode is just trying to fake difficulty by increasingly turning sliders to worse as you progress. Just dipped my toes in it and if the “end game” of Havoc is full on sweat meta build with discord group, then I am not sure if the time is worth it. Might just do havoc 1-5 or 1-10 per week for progress on some of the penances and ever so slowly go towards those cosmetic rewards. ---
**Author:** ![1Cake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/1/cc9497/32.png) [@1Cake](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/1Cake)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2024, 10:30pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/havoc-game-mode-artificial-difficulty/103063/126 "2024-12-11T22:30:38Z")
There is a weapon family that is fantastic vs gunners and shooters - Infantry lasguns. Slap Ghost on that bad boy and party like it’s patch 7. They might see a comeback now when shooters are a threat again AND with ammo stashes giving less ammo. Might try that myself when I’ll have more time. ---
**Author:** ![TrueZealot](https://dub1.discourse-cdn.com/flex013/user_avatar/forums.fatsharkgames.com/truezealot/32/63618_2.png) [@TrueZealot](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/TrueZealot)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2024, 10:41pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/havoc-game-mode-artificial-difficulty/103063/127 "2024-12-11T22:41:22Z")
Potato potato, difficulty artificial difficulty. ---
**Author:** ![Crayvun](https://dub1.discourse-cdn.com/flex013/user_avatar/forums.fatsharkgames.com/crayvun/32/60745_2.png) [@Crayvun](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/Crayvun)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2024, 12:01pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/havoc-game-mode-artificial-difficulty/103063/128 "2024-12-12T12:01:26Z")
That is my literal core build since I started playing (Infantry las, chainsword), and its what I used for most of Havoc. I switched once I hit the wall to using meta build: Bolter & duelling sword with VoC. I doubt anyone seriously considering my other suggestions though hmm? Says a lot about how the game is balanced these days that there are entire weapon families, build paths and even a CLASS that is unviable for Havoc. Ogryn getting declined from havoc lobbies, THAT is the biggest crime. ---
**Author:** ![morfin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8dc957/32.png) [@morfin](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/morfin)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2024, 12:04pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/havoc-game-mode-artificial-difficulty/103063/129 "2024-12-12T12:04:03Z")
Or you could just consistently burn everything down with recon ignoring _urine_ skin modifier ---
**Author:** ![Ralendil](https://dub1.discourse-cdn.com/flex013/user_avatar/forums.fatsharkgames.com/ralendil/32/108313_2.png) [@Ralendil](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/Ralendil)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2024, 12:08pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/havoc-game-mode-artificial-difficulty/103063/130 "2024-12-12T12:08:40Z")
> [@Jado](#): > > The entire squad (striketeam and pubs) pulled our weight, and we achieved our goal together. And the entire squad has got it. I take my time with Havoc. I have reached the level 30 (that will update next week)… And as I don’t want to climb one by one the havoc levels, I wait it updates to request invitation to level 35 next week (cause you get refusal when you ask and have a level 25 displayed). Must say that the mode is annoying (I don’t feel I can take my veteran in it) but the modifiers and penalties lead players to act as a team. And this is a welcomed change if we compare with regular or auric boards. ---
**Author:** ![1Cake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/1/cc9497/32.png) [@1Cake](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/1Cake)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2024, 12:30pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/havoc-game-mode-artificial-difficulty/103063/131 "2024-12-12T12:30:29Z")
Every class is viable in havoc, if the player is capable. I’m not gonna lie, it takes something to play Ogryn that I don’t have in me, but I’ve played with people who can carry the team with that class. In theory, Havok is the mode where Ogryns can really shine because everyone is watching each other’s back, and support abilities are so prevalent at the moment. Teams also progress through maps slower which is optimal for Ogryns. When the players as a whole improve and adjust to Havoc, meta will become less rigid, just like it did before with Aurics and CIVI/IIIVEG. Right now we are at the shallow end of the pool, learning to not drown in green рiss. Have some patience. ---
**Author:** ![Ralendil](https://dub1.discourse-cdn.com/flex013/user_avatar/forums.fatsharkgames.com/ralendil/32/108313_2.png) [@Ralendil](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/Ralendil)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2024, 12:47pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/havoc-game-mode-artificial-difficulty/103063/132 "2024-12-12T12:47:51Z")
> [@1Cake](#): > > Every class is viable in havoc, if the player is capable. I’m not gonna lie, it takes something to play Ogryn that I don’t have in me, but I’ve played with people who can carry the team with that class. Did you try veteran with IAG? I wait to see a video of this at level 40 Havoc. ---
**Author:** ![1Cake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/1/cc9497/32.png) [@1Cake](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/1Cake)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2024, 1:01pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/havoc-game-mode-artificial-difficulty/103063/133 "2024-12-12T13:01:38Z")
I’m not going to try that, I don’t think I can manage IAG ammo good enough to do my job yet. Not with 75% ammo pickup reduction. ---
**Author:** ![Ralendil](https://dub1.discourse-cdn.com/flex013/user_avatar/forums.fatsharkgames.com/ralendil/32/108313_2.png) [@Ralendil](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/Ralendil)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2024, 1:04pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/havoc-game-mode-artificial-difficulty/103063/134 "2024-12-12T13:04:35Z")
> [@1Cake](#): > > Not with 75% ammo pickup reduction. Exactly… that’s my problem about havoc. It restricts gameplays… even I would say, it forbids a lot of builds. ---
**Author:** ![1Cake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/1/cc9497/32.png) [@1Cake](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/1Cake)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2024, 1:11pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/havoc-game-mode-artificial-difficulty/103063/135 "2024-12-12T13:11:01Z")
We need time to adapt. If you really want to play with IAGs in Havoc you will learn to do it. ---
**Author:** ![Ralendil](https://dub1.discourse-cdn.com/flex013/user_avatar/forums.fatsharkgames.com/ralendil/32/108313_2.png) [@Ralendil](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/Ralendil)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2024, 1:15pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/havoc-game-mode-artificial-difficulty/103063/136 "2024-12-12T13:15:09Z")
> [@1Cake](#): > > If you really want to play with IAGs in Havoc you will learn to do it. With -75% ammo replenishment? no way. Or, I will have to use it as spare weapon and so I have to go to melee veteran. But this means I don’t use IAG, or rarely. This is the only hidden modifier that is a big problem for me. As a zealot, I don’t care. But I am already at -75%, and I cannot imagine playing a veteran ranged orientated with an IAG or a brauto. ---
**Author:** ![zaygr](https://dub1.discourse-cdn.com/flex013/user_avatar/forums.fatsharkgames.com/zaygr/32/71131_2.png) [@zaygr](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/zaygr)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2024, 1:16pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/havoc-game-mode-artificial-difficulty/103063/137 "2024-12-12T13:16:56Z")
There are too many modifiers (hidden or otherwise) that simply do not affect zealots, or affects the other archetypes out of proportion compared to zealot. ---
**Author:** ![1Cake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/1/cc9497/32.png) [@1Cake](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/1Cake)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2024, 1:19pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/havoc-game-mode-artificial-difficulty/103063/138 "2024-12-12T13:19:46Z")
> [@zaygr](#): > > There are too many modifiers (hidden or otherwise) that simply do not affect zealots Or Psykers. ---
**Author:** ![Ralendil](https://dub1.discourse-cdn.com/flex013/user_avatar/forums.fatsharkgames.com/ralendil/32/108313_2.png) [@Ralendil](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/Ralendil)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2024, 1:25pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/havoc-game-mode-artificial-difficulty/103063/139 "2024-12-12T13:25:57Z")
Or Ogryn melee ---
**Author:** ![zaygr](https://dub1.discourse-cdn.com/flex013/user_avatar/forums.fatsharkgames.com/zaygr/32/71131_2.png) [@zaygr](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/zaygr)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2024, 1:33pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/havoc-game-mode-artificial-difficulty/103063/140 "2024-12-12T13:33:47Z")
They had to deliberately add a perils quell penalty as a hidden modifier. The ammo reduction and pus skin modifiers disproportionately affects veteran. Ogryn suffers from Fading light significantly more because of their large hitbox and smaller dodge/slide windows. The corruption modifiers screws everyone more unless you have a beacon zealot. Where’s the hard to see and overlapping with other visual modifiers, randomly less melee damage modifier? Or the modifier that specifically hits zealot? ---
**Author:** ![1Cake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/1/cc9497/32.png) [@1Cake](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/1Cake)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2024, 1:49pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/havoc-game-mode-artificial-difficulty/103063/141 "2024-12-12T13:49:00Z")
> [@zaygr](#): > > They had to deliberately add a perils quell penalty as a hidden modifier. That would actually benefit psykers, because they want to stay at high peril. [Previous page](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/havoc-game-mode-artificial-difficulty/103063.md?page=6) [Next page](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/havoc-game-mode-artificial-difficulty/103063.md?page=8)