Franz Lohner's Chronicles

Hehe, that’s all true, but that’s not what I meant. Kruber is not “legal good”, no character in the U5+ is. Krub has killed more than one superior but that doesn’t diminish his loyalty to his comrades, as you pointed out, nor to the cause of defending the empire - although after the loss of his troop he was so broken he thought he was going to retire.
That’s the kind of devotion I expect an organization like the Reikshammer might go for: loyalty to comrades and desire to defend the empire no matter the cost. Having killed a few of his superiors is probably seen as a virtue rather than a fault: shows a willingness to get things done, enterprising spirit, taking responsibility, etc.
Now, I’m not defending the morality of any of those things, mind you, just saying that no such organization is a moral one, and those are some of the things you might be called to do in its service.
If you think Lonher hasn’t done worse I believe you are mistaken. He must have killed - directly or indirectly - droves of people for the cause of the empire, not all of them in battles.
If you remember, he kept a fat pig in the basement of the red moon inn, I am quite sure that was for disposing bodies.
Out of the U5, precisely Kruber was asked to join that order - although admittedly, that might have more to do with race than anything else :stuck_out_tongue:

Loyalty to comrades and cause is likely a big deal to a super secret order but, how willing would they be to accept a guy with a history for killing his officers when he doesnt like them? …Not that its certain they´d know about it. Or him at all.

To even have a shot at thinking he´d be good even then they´d need detailed files on the guys he killed and him at the time which doesnt seem to likely at all.

Dunno what we´d class as worse though, Lohner may have caused a lot of deaths in his line of work but on the other hand he has the umbrella of that being his work and it being for a cause of saving more life. I´d say that marks him up as “grey” if going by a color coded morality.

Kruber killing officers because he did not like them while enlisted in the army and having been a bandit like merc at some point for his own profit? I´d say him and Sienna are the two of the U5 leaning the most towards being morally bankrupt…sienna especially having actually been a bandit among other things.

…Banditry might actually be among the least of her offenses :sweat_smile:

:joy:

Dunno, i do not think any of them quite meet the mark. Saltz is too rigid, Sienna too free-spirited while Kruber does not have the foundation or background to help establish him as trustworthy.

Soldier-merc-bandit-raider…turned soldier again? Turned bodyguard who left the army in the wake of all his buddies dying ontop of losing all his family shortly after? He has no cause and his morality&ties are about as clear as Lohner´s exact position in the imperial command.

Nah, he´s a misfit just like the others and that´s why they all fit so nicely together ^^

“Edit”,

So yeah i do not think he is a good fit for a super spy order like the reikshammer but for something like what Lohner runs? A very good fit.

“End of edit”

This is interesting, because Kruber killed them not out of a personal dislike but for their incompetence, or their brutality towards the soldiers. Which in a time of war could be seen as actually saving lives (again not defending the morality there, but it’d be a bit what Lonher does, greater good and everything). I don’t remember the exact lines, but I’m quite sure their incompetence cost a lot of men.

Now, Kruber refers to pillaging: again this is interesting, because while the act is much the same as banditry, it’s quite common in wartimes - medieval in primis - and it wasn’t frowned upon as much. I don’t remember any notion of Kruber being a bandit (correct me if I’m wrong). In fact, probably due to his poor upbringing, he quite resented bandits, and it’s precisely his efficiency at dispatching them (when he was at his all-time low in his life, to boot) which spurred Saltzpyre to request his services.
I’m not saying Kruber is a shiny example of virtue - he isn’t, expecially by modern standards - but for a soldier, he’s a pretty great guy.

Also interestingly, you bundled Sienna together with him as “morally bankrupt”: while you definitely have some points, I think Sienna is the most “moral” of the U5. By that I mean she is driven by ideas of justice. The only reason she let Satzpyre bind her, is that “he might not care about justice, but I do”. Sienna’s first foray into Ubersreik is hidden in one of her hat’s descrpition in the first game: She did actually burn two of the burgomeister properties and killed his son, but it’s strongly implied he was a child murderer (and rapist, probably), and the textile factory fire reavealed a lot of shallow graves around said factory - a fact the burgomeister struggled to keep hidden.
Given how strongly he was protected by the law (a collusive authority that is) and our wizard’s short temper she presumably thought “f :heart:k all” and burned it all to the ground. A morally despicable act? Perhaps, but it’s true that going through the official channels could not have done anything, and even if it did, how many children would have died in the meantime?
I love this about her character: even as a self-conscious addict, she always struggles to do the right thing (her biggest fear is killing innocent people in a fire-addiction rampage) and she’s prepared - nay, willing - to take responsibility for her actions.
This doesn’t diminish what you said, by the way, she’d probably agree with you :wink: but I felt it was quite important to give her her due. I hope you don’t mind how long this turned out to be :slight_smile:

It was never actually specified why he killed the officers was it? More than hinted that he found them incompetent or disliked them for one reason or another. But he does have a conversation with saltz where he states he´d like a shot at higher command as he finds the imperial one to not be doing a good enough job.

It wasnt outright banditry but he does have a points where Nurgloth takes shots at him for thinking about a “blood price” that his teammates might have. I´d guess that´d be something like darker merc work where they ambush and kill people for gold.

But yeah he does have a strong dislike for bandits now that you mention it, he hates the idea of bullying common folks which is why he probably does get along to a degree with saltz who is hellbent on protecting them, in his own way.

She isnt driven by her ideas of justice, what drives her is her addiction of using her power. If she was driven by her ideals she´d basically be the same as saltz but replacing sigmar&the empire in the lines with “good” “justice” “people”.

She left the mage college because she was bored, she roamed the world as a merc mage selling her power to whoever would let her use it and did so happily for the rush it gave her, even when it lead to burning down parts of cities or villages here or there…and while she has her ideals&a bottom line her temper often gets in her way like when she kills a witch hunter to protect a friend but then it turns out that the guy was actually right and her friend was a real nasty chaos witch.

That temper and an even larger addiction are only held back by a thin line thanks to experiences gained of a lifetime of mistakes and accidents brought about by the two. A life of working as a merc, even a bandit,for the sake of using her power and killing people left and right when angered shows that her ideals are very loosely defined.

The only clear thing about her is the bottom line where she goes out of her own way to kill those she deems absolute evil like the rapist noble. And as you mentioned, where she doesnt want to kill people not involved in her business.

And as for taking responsibility? How do you explain her running away from that city whose old quarters she set on fire during her bandit work? :sweat_smile:

Only reason i can imagine her letting saltz catch her is probably a dose of depression in the wake of the rush from the prior powersurge. She figured that lifestyle was gona cause a big problem down the line so why not?

Actually no, there’s a dialogue in the first game which explicitly mentions what I loosely quoted as

You can probably find it here: 20 minutes of Vermintide hero dialogue - YouTube
I never said she’s not an addict and she doesn’t take all the chances she has to let loose (although striving not to kill innocents). It’s what she’s imagining Saltzpyre must do, to which he replies “conflict, witch? I do not experience spiritual conflict, my cause is just”. That’s the main difference between the two characters: sienna really questions what she does. And like an addict, she suffers from a lot of guilt trips.
I don’t think her being an addict prevents her from being a moral character. I find that to be one of her defining characteristics. As for the “exhuberance” of her past, she sometimes regrets that, sometimes she doesn’t that’s true. We don’t know much about those to be able to do more than educated guesses (besides the burgomeister one) but moroften than not, she seems to do bad things to bad people. And there’s a lot of those in the Warhammer world. Even when she burned one of her masters (don’t remember which one) she says he had a penchant for beating young girls with his staffs. In fact, from the descriptions of the red items, most BWs must be real arseholes. :stuck_out_tongue:

@Frostysir was talking about Lohner, not Kruber

True, being an addict and being morally upright deep down are not mutually exclusive. But, if her addiction is so strong it can bypass her sense of justice to lead her into going to work as a loan shark/merc/bandit or whatnot then i´d question how strong it actually is in practice for things that do not touch her bottom line. The burgomeister case was one that did, but at the same time isnt it the only confirmed case of her acting vigilante style against a confirmed evil?

She lived in Tilea for a while and as far as i know she didnt burn the whole country down despite later saying every man in power there was corrupt as heck while the women were all poisoners. Moreover she doesn’t just take all the chances she can get to use her power, she actively works, or at least did work, to obtain more and more chances in the form of looking for employment where her active services were appreciated.

As for the grey mage(first teacher) she toasted, well he was an arse and had it coming for playing with fire😉 But she seems to later have had a peaceful time in pyro school minus being a bit crazy herself at that time.

Just the famous and powerful ones, goes for most mages in warhammer really.

Bardin is ready to be a murder hobo! I mean, adventurer! Yes, that’s the term.

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Well, personally, after the short stories about Khorne and Tzeentch, I was expecting a story about Slaanesh … Maybe next time.

Either way, this is adorable.

And as usual, I ask dear Developers to add all these “Chronicles” to the game. For example, hide Lohner’s Diary in a secret place in the Keep.

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That’d be fu**ing amazing

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This is about Grandpapa Nurgle, very typical. :nurgle:

I still await Lohner’s comments about Slaanesh.

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Again, this is not a commentary about Slaanesh. DAMN

Count Mordrek is he:

No boy. I would explore this new realm I have been drawn up into. Perhaps there are wonders and horrors yet that I have not witnessed. If so, they might enliven the tedium of eternity, if only for a few centuries. But if you need me, simply blow the slughorn you carry, and Count Mordrek will ride with all haste to your aid.

~Mordrek

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Clear. A bold hint about upcoming Sienna’s Premium Career. :sun_with_face:

It’s fine. But first, show me Warhammer miniature or at least official art on which it will be based.

She cares little for genuflection and prayers - all that matters to the Goddess of War is triumph.

Acts of Sacrifice (short story) by Evan Dicken.

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or Bardin’s next engineer weapon :wink:
I can definitely see him weaponising a brass trumpet :smiley:

They don’t stop - good.

Has Victor found faith again? Okay, make him a Warrior Priest … of the Kislevite Great Orthodoxy. :bear: This will be a twist!

:flushed:

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Any clues about what this Skakgal could mean?

Skakgal sounds more like a name than a Dwarfish word. Although I might be wrong, if I was to take a guess maybe a name of a Demon or Skaven? Perhaps the leader of the surprise assault that cost Bardin his son?

My guess would be “stolen gold”.

I’m not following you. That sentence is in the chronicle…

Oh yes, I didn’t mean it litterally, I’m wondering if some lore-savvy can provide a hypotesis.
I guess it could be a name, and it looks like Bardin knows about it already.

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