# Elf needs a nerf **URL:** \ **Category:** Gameplay Feedback\ **Created:** [July 1, 2021, 5:54pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/elf-needs-a-nerf/46193 "2021-07-01T17:54:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 1\ **Showing post:** 639
**Author:** ![Kitten](https://dub1.discourse-cdn.com/flex013/user_avatar/forums.fatsharkgames.com/kitten/32/3725_2.png) [@Kitten](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/u/Kitten)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2021, 1:57pm UTC](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/elf-needs-a-nerf/46193/639 "2021-12-21T13:57:17Z")
> [@alsozara](#): > > WS is one of those classes that just about needs an entire rework, they’re so haphazardly built around almost exclusively the ult and ranged uptime (which itself comes from ammo generation from the ult). However if you nerf those aspects too much you kinda leave the career f all compared to the other ranged classes. I dunno, bloodshot ults notwithstanding, WS isn’t that high on the priority list for me. If they’re gonna deal with anything else specifically regarding her it should be hagbane. Moonbow is obviously high priority but it’s an across elf issue, not specific to WS I still feel the same. Shade still does OP damage. Moonbow/Hag are broken with WS. The last 2 rows of her tree need a rework. - 20% CDR is a boring passive and just too good. Nothing else competes on that row - Last row, sustained ammo is just the easiest and best option over all (piercing is too situational, and broken interaction with Bloodshot shouldn’t count with the extra arrow Ult) This was the thread where we discussed WS **(THIS WAS PRE-MOONFIRE/JAVELINE):** > [@Waystalker forgotten in the BBB](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/waystalker-forgotten-in-the-bbb/42100): > > Waystalker: As nothing was changed with Waystalker in the BBB patch, and her last two rows are still kind of dull and too passive, I thought I’d make a thread to discuss why, and maybe see what can be done about it. There’s barely any diverse or interesting builds other than Asrai Focus + Kurnous’ Reward, as they passively offer too much, when compared to the alternatives. In my opinion, getting rid of the Asrai Focus + Kurnous’ Reward combination altogether, and replacing those Talents with … Moonbow breakpoints may need some tweaking, including making it more headshot dependent. Greatsword is decent, but isn’t as satisfying to use on anything other than HM. 1H Axe still sucks, mainly because of movement speed while attacking. Glaive is fun on HM, but other Careers just get stuck in the mud. Handmaiden is in a really good state right now. Crit stacking, getting Hunter up and maintaining Ult stacks, feels like you’re actively working towards keeping buffs up, which is fun. Shade is still broken in terms of Melee DPS, and her tree doesn’t really allow for anything other than Dual Wield Crit Power or Headshot build with the CDR Ult (or Spear). She’s quite dull in terms of build diversity as half of her Talents aren’t worth taking. - Her Crossbow was only ever good before the Ranged Cleave nerf patch. SoTT is good. I’m still not a fan of how strong Bloodrazor Thicket is. Would prefer this to become an AoE root with high DoT damage or something, although I think the usefulness of Blackvenom Thicket can outdo it in higher DPS Cata+ comps (e.g. with an Unchained using the Coruscation Staff). - Ironbark Thicket isn’t worth using over Blackvenom, as Blackvenom is still only useful because of the AoE damage increase (which becomes really strong in Cata+). Ironbark needs a defensive buff to those near to it, imo. I’ve changed my mind on Jav. It can be completely broken on SoTT. --- _[View the full topic](https://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/elf-needs-a-nerf/46193)._