Cloak of Mist

Please don’t keep this in the game. That’s so ridiculous.

You’ve basically given one of the best DPS Careers in the game a buff.

At least limit it to 2 handers and 1 handers, not DW, which already has enough from her builds and it benefits DW the most.

It’s also arguably better than her normal Ultimate, because you can kill more enemies each time, and it’s made her damage more versatile than it already was.

4 Likes

I like the idea, but the implementation is just… eh, hard to agree with.

I like giving up the massive damage bonus from the ult in exchange of something other than just a shorter CD, lets be honest, no one used cloak of mist before, so a change was probably needed, and I don’t really support the idea of making one of the lvl 30 talents work only with a certain type of weapon as suggested.

That said, right now it’s proccing with vanish, which I’m sure is unintended, as that’s just broken, potentially giving you 100% crit during a whole horde, there’s simply no way this was intended after nerfing a 10% from daggers.

Assuming no vanish, well, whc gets 100% crit for 6 seconds on a 90 second cd and it has more utility along the crit, so I’d say for this talent to not be broken, it shouldn’t reduce the cooldown this much, maybe a 20% instead of a 45%? haven’t done any math though.

EDIT (kinda late sorry): It also shouldn’t work with ranged attacks, makes no sense to nerf bloodfletcher and give 4 seconds of guaranteed scrounger, you can instantly refill a swiftbow or a xbow.

5 Likes

The interactions also seem to be extremely buggy currently and maybe instead of 4 seconds of guaranteed crits it should be something like next 2 hits instead?
Honestly i kinda like the idea but even with the above it just might be too powerful.
At the very least the ranged interaction needs to be killed outright if anything.

1 Like

Next 2 hits would kill it.

I like it now.
If you spec into it really hard, you have moments of low DPS… and moments of absolute brutality.

The amount of hits can always be argued but the current iteration at least is stupidly good.

1 Like

if you make it an amount of hits, you favour some weapons over others.
You usually have a cleave x speed ratio.
Duration balances out with the overall balance of attack speeds

Duration also generally heavily prefers faster attacking weapons like DD/SnD. At least my idea would generally prefer the slower / hard hitting ones.

1 Like

The only thing my friend said after that match was “why have they added this?”

It already gives DW more than any other Weapon, and as long as you run CDR on Trinket and Crit Power it’s going to be broken for DD/SnD.

Crit fishing and the fact that the damage just got made more versatile is why it’s OP. You no longer Ult 1 CW a minute, you Ult every Elite you possibly can, and then Crit fish Hordes when there aren’t any.

When I saw they had buffed it, I was expecting like a Crit% on ranged or something, to make it a proper Special killing build. What they’ve done has completely broken it. It’s almost as if they assume she does no damage outside of her Ults, which is far from true.

In the SS, my friend said he just ran around Light Attacking everything, and that was the outcome.

4 Likes

Original Cloak of Mist was an interesting design, it introduced a whole new playstyle to the character but really lacked oomph.

Its needs something… but not this.

4 Likes

Even besides the damage output, it doesn’t seem to play well with the intention.
As i understand this was geared as “stealthy infiltration behind horde” kind of thing, which doesn’t really make it play well with core game mechanics.

Primarly because if you don’t position yourself clearly away from the horde, you will be stuck inside them as soon as you pop out of stealth.
Secondarily because AI doesn’t really stop targetting “invisible” characters, they’re just forbidden from attacking so as soon as your invisibility ends inside a large horde, you’ll get 2/3/4 enemies instantly whacking you because they’re no longer prohibited from attacking and they had you targetted all the time.

1 Like

Looks like I’m late to the party, they already patched it.

Last night was crazy, was running a trash greatsword/shortbow build with cloak of mist and doing stupid crap like ulting and then running backwards through the horde so every attack would be a back stab. Crowning moment was shooting a stormfiend to death with infinite shortbow because he refused to come into melee range the entire time he was alive :yum:

Wasn’t I making passive comments in the other Kerri thread about HM having her crit ult or greatsword nerfed because you could achieve 50% crit chance with it? I take it back. I’m now totally fine with classes like HM and Pyro being able to build into 50% melee crit chance because those classes do not get access to crit-based insta kill passives.

2 Likes

It was a bit broken… But insanely fun ^^

1 Like

i agree that the cooldown reduction can be something like 25%, that is if the crit duration remains unchanged. nerfing both the cooldown reduction and crit duration seems overkill. or perhaps a 30% cooldown and 3 sec crit duration would be more balanced, the important think is that it must be a good choice.

1 Like

I’m not sure it’s that Cloak of Mist is actually OP. Let’s compare it to Fervency.

Fervency gets you 6 seconds of guaranteed melee critical hits, with a really useful AoE stagger on top, with a cooldown of 90 seconds. Additionally, headshot crits with WHC kill instantly.
Cloak of Mist gets you 4 seconds of guaranteed melee critical hits, with invisibility on top, with a cooldown of 36 seconds. Additionally, backstab crits with Shade kill instantly.

It’s worth mentioning getting headshots is much easier than getting backstabs, and much less risky, since going for backstabs in the middle of a horde is liable to get you killed instantly. Fervency wins this round.

Also, I would consider the AoE stagger to be much more useful than 5 seconds of invisibility, since it can get you out of some really tight spots and support the entire team as well. Fervency wins this round again.

In regards to uptime, you can use Cloak of Mist 2.5 times for each time you could have used Fervency. Overall this means you get ~10 seconds of uptime per 6 seconds of uptime Fervency gets. Cloak of Mist wins this round.
Note: I didn’t take CDR regeneration mechanics into consideration here. Just pure cooldown numbers.

To me, Cloak of Mist makes a lot of sense on a glass cannon career such as Shade, and it isn’t obvious which of Fervency and Cloak of Mist is better. Both make sense on their respective careers.

1 Like

That’s the thing though, Cloak doesn’t end until the Shade messes up stealth backstabs or runs out of stealth. Saltz is also at way more risk while trying to benefit from his Ult and also has to revert back to throwing pushes in etc once it has ended. Shade just spams lights at back of a full enemy model.

And the strength of the actual Ult uptime/knockback is cancelled out by the fact that you can get 2 Shade Ults off.

The absolute killing power of Shade is enough to outdo having a stun, especially when you only need Lights to clear Elite density, and don’t need to aim for heads to do it.

I understand why you didn’t include CDR in your comparison, but that’s all you should be running on Shade.

This was my build, and I didn’t get in trouble once, because stealth is up so frequently:

https://www.ranaldsgift.com/9/112221/26,8,5,5/16,7,7,8/3,2,1/2,6,1/1,2,3

^ actually this is wrong. I was running Movement Speed instead of Crit on Trinket.

It comes to something when you can run no defensive stats (other than the BCR on neck), and still top damage/not get in trouble, despite using a Weapon with 2 Stamina Shields.

I was using Cloak of Mists pre-buff as a Special killer just fine. I even said I would like it to get 1 free Crit for ranged or melee to make that playstyle more viable. The changes they have made are completely overkill, and land Shade where it was Pre-Wom, where you could take full CDR and spam Ults.

Someone described it as ‘going from a Boss killing Ult to a Patrol killing Ult’, when in reality, you just gained way more versatility and killing power on literally every enemy type. Going for headshots/back damage with the Ult up on Bosses completely mitigates how this person perceived role for that Ult.

Cloak of mist is such dumbly overpowered stuff right now that its not even to debate that its need change

2 Likes

Those numbers you posted can be done on a regular non cloak of mist shade so I don’t see whats so impressive here when you give up boss dps to do it. Those numbers are also probably inflated because of bots and you probably taking forever to finish the map anyway.

Something people seem to forget is that shade is a squishy 120hp career and can die to light breezes while so many other careers can pull those numbers or better while being safer. 120hp should generally = better score numbers than 150 or 180hp careers but instead we have whc, merc, slayer, gk, ib flamethrower that can all perform as well or better than her. And while she does have a stealth ult that can save her its not always up when you need it while so many other careers have stagger ults that can get you out of bad situations while also saving teammates more reliably.

Now admittedly the ult being bugged with vanish was op but I don’t see how its a problem now if its fixed. But people seem to have a hard on for nerfing elf for some silly reason.

1 Like

To be honest, having played with it a bit, it’s strong, yes, but I wouldn’t call it op.
It does give shade a nice burst of damage though ^^

Having it proc off vanish was absolutely busted.

The interaction with vanish made me hope Vanish was more reliable…

Because as I’ve mentioned in other Threads, there are builds in this game that make all of the other Weapons of the Career look silly, and adding more of these builds to the game isn’t healthy and trivializes the game.

The point with Shade is that she already has one: the headshot build.

The amount of Crit granted by this change essentially gave her a buff for no reason, even though she’s already insanely good.

The builds that overperform compared to other Weapons/builds:

  • Pyro fireball
  • Shade headshots/Crit fishing/Hag spam
  • Zealot Billhook/A+F and BoP
  • WHC Light spam Rapier
  • WS Hag spam

Semi nerfed:

  • Merc Ult
  • BW
  • BBB Swiftbow WS

Nerfed:

  • DK Slayer
  • Old CDR Shade
  • Old CDR Wigglemancer
  • Old Volley Crossbow BH
  • BH (melee kill = Crit)

The point isn’t DPS Careers gonna DPS, it’s that they trivialize the game. One person running those Careers shouldn’t be able to just solo half of the map, when they could easily still deal a decent amount of DPS while not being absurd.

2 Likes

Quickplay is already pretty unenjoyable when you have teammates that usually don’t do much of anything other than hold block all day so you’re kind of forced into do it all careers / setups. Premades aren’t something that should be expected of the average player to get enjoyment out of this game as its very tedious and unreliable to do as people aren’t always online or willing to play together.

Even if you nerfed everything into the ground i’m sure the minority of players that play in tryhard premades would still whine about the game being too easy anyway. Same could be said for low hour count players that have nothing to compare to because of a lack of experience and are just talking out of their figurative ass when saying something is good or bad.

You guys just seem to want to make every enemy a damage soaking sponge which cataclysm is already pushing in that regard.

Edit; this game feels like its in a good place in regards to being able to handle yourself in pubs while also being able to still rely on teamwork on the high end if you so choose.

2 Likes
Why not join the Fatshark Discord https://discord.gg/K6gyMpu