Do you know how I could discover any relevant changes? (I mean, short of reading through every changed file every patch.) Looking through the patch notes wasn’t helpful …
Cool! I just noticed that.
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You were right about Conflag, it’s pretty good; I wouldn’t say OP. I still prefer Beam Staff, Fireball and Bolt Staff. It may not benefit greatly from Hunter or Barrage, but Heat Sink is fine. It seems like Volcanic force is really good, but having no DOT bonuses is a big downside, since so much damage comes from Fire Sword with the other two talents, but I’ve always thought Firesword Heavy 1 is a bit silly.
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I would look at the patch notes or alternatively find the updated calculator by !ChadMasodin
My infinite cleave high stagger melee attack that applies a strong burn <3
and used to generate infinite stagger THP
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Yeah, I’ve used the calculator before for builds, I just don’t know how best to use it to optimize Conflag. I’m guessing Chaos Infantry + more Chaos Infantry, because it’s almost always going to take a couple headshots for most specials, then have a decent melee weapon for elites. The Conflag is of course, just CC, not really going to do a ton against elites, but it has great stagger.
I was using that with Volcanic Force and Sythe as melee. Worked really well. I wouldn’t say Confalg is OP by any stretch though. The talent that gives you 40% increased charge speed is really why I’d only ever use it with Volcanic force, and then a melee weapon that can handle elites fast like Flail, Crowbill, or Sythe, maybe dagger too.
With Lingering Flames though, it’s just mediocre. It’s much easier to light enemies on fire really quickly with a weapon swap using Beam or Fireball. Maybe that’s partially because I pretty much just use those or the Bolt Staff. Of course, if you have Fire Sword, that’s better than Staves, and you don’t have to worry about generating heat much.
The decimal number of the DPS can vary slightly. Numbers measured at 650 Power (no additional power).
| Burning DOT Source vs Monster | Damage Per Second |
|---|---|
| Fire walk (default) | 7.6 |
| Conflagration staff M2 (fully charged) | 7.6 |
| Beam staff M2 | 7.6 |
| Fireball staff M2 (fully charged) | 7.6 |
| Fire sword H2 | 7.6 |
| Fire sword H1 | 11.5 |
| Dagger H1 | 11.5 |
| Dagger H2 | 11.5 |
| Flaming Flail H1 | 11.5 |
| Ensorcelled Reaper L2 | 11.5 |
| Mace H1 | 11.5 |
| Crowbill L4 | 11.5 |
| Fire walk (Kaboom!) | 15.1 |
| Beam staff M1 (held) | 22.6 |
| Bugged Burn Source | Damage Per Second |
|---|---|
| Flamethrower staff M2 (bugged) | 22.7 |
| Coruscation M2 (first geyser) | 15.3 |
| Coruscation M2 (geyser despawn) | 6.9 |
Coruscation is weird with lingering specifically, the geyser cast deals high DOT damage and is overridden by a weaker DOT as soon as the geyser despawns. I’m calling it bugged.
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New & improved method by analyzing video and pulling up a calculator for lower health targets where DPS meter can’t stabilize
| Burning DOT Source vs Armour | Damage Per Second |
|---|---|
| Fire walk (default) | 4.4 |
| Conflagration staff M2 (fully charged) | 4.4 |
| Beam staff M2 | 4.4 |
| Fireball staff M2 (fully charged) | 4.4 |
| Fire sword H2 | 4.4 |
| Fire sword H1 | 6.5 |
| Dagger H1 | 6.5 |
| Dagger H2 | 6.5 |
| Flaming Flail H1 | 6.5 |
| Ensorcelled Reaper L2 | 6.5 |
| Mace H1 | 6.5 |
| Crowbill L4 | 6.5 |
| Fire walk (Kaboom!) | 9 |
| Beam staff M1 (held) | 9.5 |
| Incendiary bomb | 2,96 |
| Bugged burn source | Damage Per Second |
|---|---|
| Flamethrower staff M2 | 4.7 |
| Coruscation staff M2 (first geyser) | 3.9 |
| Coruscation staff M2 (geyser despawn) | 3.9 (4.9 w/ 10% power) |
I’m going to start using EP + 10% power for the next posts instead so we can get numbers that reflect actual in-game numbers.
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Numbers are measured using Lingering Flames at 650 power w/ Enhanced Power + 10% power.
Tick rate has a random variance of -25%/+25%.
Armour Types
| Burning DOT Source vs Monster | Damage Per Second | Damage Per Tick | Avg. Ticks Per Second |
|---|---|---|---|
| Fire walk (default) | 9 | 6.75 | 1.33 |
| Conflagration staff M2 (fully charged) | 9 | 6.75 | 1.33 |
| Beam staff M2 | 9 | 6.75 | 1.33 |
| Fireball staff M2 (fully charged) | 9 | 6.75 | 1.33 |
| Fire sword H2 | 9 | 6.75 | 1.33 |
| Fire sword H1 | 13.5 | 6.75 | 2 |
| Dagger H1 | 13.5 | 6.75 | 2 |
| Dagger H2 | 13.5 | 6.75 | 2 |
| Flaming Flail H1 | 13.5 | 6.75 | 2 |
| Ensorcelled Reaper L2 | 13.5 | 6.75 | 2 |
| Mace H1 | 13.5 | 6.75 | 2 |
| Crowbill L4 | 13.5 | 6.75 | 2 |
| Fire walk (Kaboom!) | 18 | 6.75 | 2.67 |
| Beam staff M1 (held) | 27.5 | 13.75 | 2 |
| [Bugged] Flamethrower staff M2 | 27 | 9 | 3 |
| [Bugged?] Coruscation M2 (first geyser) | 15.7 | 4 | 3.92? |
| [Bugged?] Coruscation M2 (geyser despawn) | 8.8 | 2.25 | 3.92? |
| Burning DOT Source vs Infantry | Damage Per Second | Damage Per Tick | Avg. Ticks Per Second |
|---|---|---|---|
| Fire walk (default) | 6.67 | 5 | 1.33 |
| Conflagration staff M2 (fully charged) | 6.67 | 5 | 1.33 |
| Beam staff M2 | 6.67 | 5 | 1.33 |
| Fireball staff M2 (fully charged) | 6.67 | 5 | 1.33 |
| Fire sword H2 | 6.67 | 5 | 1.33 |
| Fire sword H1 | 10 | 5 | 2 |
| Dagger H1 | 10 | 5 | 2 |
| Dagger H2 | 10 | 5 | 2 |
| Flaming Flail H1 | 10 | 5 | 2 |
| Ensorcelled Reaper L2 | 10 | 5 | 2 |
| Mace H1 | 10 | 5 | 2 |
| Crowbill L4 | 10 | 5 | 2 |
| Fire walk (Kaboom!) | 13.33 | 5 | 2.67 |
| Beam staff M1 (held) | 15 | 7.5 | 2 |
| Flamethrower staff M2 (bugged) | 19 | 6.5 | 3 |
| Burning DOT Source vs Armour | Damage Per Second | Damage Per Tick | Avg. Ticks Per Second |
|---|---|---|---|
| Fire walk (default) | 5 | 3.75 | 1.33 |
| Conflagration staff M2 (fully charged) | 5 | 3.75 | 1.33 |
| Beam staff M2 | 5 | 3.75 | 1.33 |
| Fireball staff M2 (fully charged) | 5 | 3.75 | 1.33 |
| Fire sword H2 | 5 | 3.75 | 1.33 |
| Fire sword H1 | 7.5 | 3.75 | 2 |
| Dagger H1 | 7.5 | 3.75 | 2 |
| Dagger H2 | 7.5 | 3.75 | 2 |
| Flaming Flail H1 | 7.5 | 3.75 | 2 |
| Ensorcelled Reaper L2 | 7.5 | 3.75 | 2 |
| Mace H1 | 7.5 | 3.75 | 2 |
| Crowbill L4 | 7.5 | 3.75 | 2 |
| Fire walk (Kaboom!) | 10 | 3.75 | 2.67 |
| Beam staff M1 (held) | 11.5 | 5.75 | 2 |
| Flamethrower staff M2 (bugged) | 5.25 | 1.75 | 3 |
| Burning DOT Source vs Berserker | Damage Per Second | Damage Per Tick | Avg. Ticks Per Second |
|---|---|---|---|
| Fire walk (default) | 6.67 | 5 | 1.33 |
| Conflagration staff M2 (fully charged) | 6.67 | 5 | 1.33 |
| Beam staff M2 | 6.67 | 5 | 1.33 |
| Fireball staff M2 (fully charged) | 6.67 | 5 | 1.33 |
| Fire sword H2 | 6.67 | 5 | 1.33 |
| Fire sword H1 | 10 | 5 | 2 |
| Dagger H1 | 10 | 5 | 2 |
| Dagger H2 | 10 | 5 | 2 |
| Flaming Flail H1 | 10 | 5 | 2 |
| Ensorcelled Reaper L2 | 10 | 5 | 2 |
| Mace H1 | 10 | 5 | 2 |
| Crowbill L4 | 10 | 5 | 2 |
| Fire walk (Kaboom!) | 13.33 | 5 | 2.67 |
| Beam staff M1 (held) | 15 | 7.5 | 2 |
| Flamethrower staff M2 (bugged) | 19 | 6.5 | 3 |
| Burning DOT Source vs Super Armour | Damage Per Second | Damage Per Tick | Avg. Ticks Per Second |
|---|---|---|---|
| Fire walk (default) | 3.33 | 2.5 | 1.33 |
| Conflagration staff M2 (fully charged) | 3.33 | 2.5 | 1.33 |
| Beam staff M2 | 3.33 | 2.5 | 1.33 |
| Fireball staff M2 (fully charged) | 3.33 | 2.5 | 1.33 |
| Fire sword H2 | 3.33 | 2.5 | 1.33 |
| Fire sword H1 | 5 | 2.5 | 2 |
| Dagger H1 | 5 | 2.5 | 2 |
| Dagger H2 | 5 | 2.5 | 2 |
| Flaming Flail H1 | 5 | 2.5 | 2 |
| Ensorcelled Reaper L2 | 5 | 2.5 | 2 |
| Mace H1 | 5 | 2.5 | 2 |
| Crowbill L4 | 5 | 2.5 | 2 |
| Fire walk (Kaboom!) | 6.67 | 2.5 | 2.67 |
| Beam staff M1 (held) | 7.5 | 3.75 | 2 |
| Flamethrower staff M2 (bugged) | 9.75 | 3.25 | 3 |
Lords
| Burning DOT Source vs Bödvarr/Gatekeeper/Skarrik | Damage Per Second | Damage Per Tick | Avg. Ticks Per Second |
|---|---|---|---|
| Fire walk (default) | 2.67 | 2 | 1.33 |
| Conflagration staff M2 (fully charged) | 2.67 | 2 | 1.33 |
| Beam staff M2 | 2.67 | 2 | 1.33 |
| Fireball staff M2 (fully charged) | 2.67 | 2 | 1.33 |
| Fire sword H2 | 2.67 | 2 | 1.33 |
| Fire sword H1 | 4 | 2 | 2 |
| Dagger H1 | 4 | 2 | 2 |
| Dagger H2 | 4 | 2 | 2 |
| Flaming Flail H1 | 4 | 2 | 2 |
| Ensorcelled Reaper L2 | 4 | 2 | 2 |
| Mace H1 | 4 | 2 | 2 |
| Crowbill L4 | 4 | 2 | 2 |
| Fire walk (Kaboom!) | 5.33 | 2 | 2.67 |
| Beam staff M1 (held) | 6 | 3 | 2 |
| Flamethrower staff M2 (bugged) | 4.5 | 1.5 | 3 |
| Burning DOT Source vs Rasknitt/Nurgloth | Damage Per Second | Damage Per Tick | Avg. Ticks Per Second |
|---|---|---|---|
| Fire walk (default) | 1.33 | 1 | 1.33 |
| Conflagration staff M2 (fully charged) | 1.33 | 1 | 1.33 |
| Beam staff M2 | 1.33 | 1 | 1.33 |
| Fireball staff M2 (fully charged) | 1.33 | 1 | 1.33 |
| Fire sword H2 | 1.33 | 1 | 1.33 |
| Fire sword H1 | 2 | 1 | 2 |
| Dagger H1 | 2 | 1 | 2 |
| Dagger H2 | 2 | 1 | 2 |
| Flaming Flail H1 | 2 | 1 | 2 |
| Ensorcelled Reaper L2 | 2 | 1 | 2 |
| Mace H1 | 2 | 1 | 2 |
| Crowbill L4 | 2 | 1 | 2 |
| Fire walk (Kaboom!) | 2.67 | 1 | 2.67 |
| Beam staff M1 (held) | 3 | 1.5 | 2 |
| Flamethrower staff M2 (bugged) | 3.75 | 1.25 | 3 |
| Burning DOT Source vs Halescourge/Deathrattler | Damage Per Second | Damage Per Tick | Avg. Ticks Per Second |
|---|---|---|---|
| Fire walk (default) | 4 | 3 | 1.33 |
| Conflagration staff M2 (fully charged) | 4 | 3 | 1.33 |
| Beam staff M2 | 4 | 3 | 1.33 |
| Fireball staff M2 (fully charged) | 4 | 3 | 1.33 |
| Fire sword H2 | 4 | 3 | 1.33 |
| Fire sword H1 | 6 | 3 | 2 |
| Dagger H1 | 6 | 3 | 2 |
| Dagger H2 | 6 | 3 | 2 |
| Flaming Flail H1 | 6 | 3 | 2 |
| Ensorcelled Reaper L2 | 6 | 3 | 2 |
| Mace H1 | 6 | 3 | 2 |
| Crowbill L4 | 6 | 3 | 2 |
| Fire walk (Kaboom!) | 8 | 3 | 2.67 |
| Beam staff M1 (held) | 12 | 6 | 2 |
| Flamethrower staff M2 (bugged) | 12 | 4 | 3 |
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Holy crap man! I was thinking of making a video demonstration on a rat ogre, never used spawning mod before, but you’re much more committed to giving all your free time to us. I commend you. It sure would be nice if Fatshark simply laid all the stats bare for us to see, instead of having to test everything thoroughly.
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Thank you. Though I feel like a dumbass for the fact that I didn’t think to measure the tick rate until after I finished measuring the DPS against everything. I could’ve saved a bunch of time & effort if I thought of doing that earlier.
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First of all Thank you very much!, So it seams to be the high tickrate for flamethrower which makes it busted, because the 1,75 damage per tick vs armor would be initself fine, but the tickrate makes it still stronger than fireball staff etc. I am curious if it is truly bugged or an imbalanced feature. Overall i think tickrate should be for every staff the same and only damage per tick should vary. Seems easier to balance and there you can pay attention as developer to each staff by its own. Because in general i think you guys are right that it overperforms, but looking at conflag staff my stomach hurts when there will be a general nerf over all staves.
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High tick rate makes a staff’s potential DPS output difficult to predict when you’re in an actual game obtaining and losing buffs while fighting as a difference of .25 can change its DPS more than you’d expect it to be. This is in part why barrage can be stronger than what its description would lead you to believe. This could be solved if there were more decimals other than .25 .5 .75 but making all the tick rates the same I hope would make it easier to understand and for small power increases to be less influential and easier to balance.
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