Bloodfletcher change - Crits

While I can see where the change to bloodfletcher is coming from, I would like to see a different approach to it:

Make bloodfletcher only proc on crits.

This would achieve 3 goals:
A) Reduce its effectiveness to about 25% (depending on your total crit chance obviously). It keeps the intention of the current change and removes ranged spam from Shade by quite a significant amount.

B) It would be very fitting and thematic for a crit focussed class. Shade is built around crits, so why not make bloodfletcher behave the same way.

C) It would help with the issue of being forced into a cooldown timer.
As that cooldown removes organic play (it will always stay the same, no matter if you keep backstabbing a boss or ulted to get behind a horde - no matter, only 1 ammo per dual wield heavy attack that hits more than 1 enemy), it feels not smooth at all (see resourceful combatant for how unfun artificial timers are - not that is the only issue that trait has tbh).

I prefer a more dynamic change to bloodfletcher.

If it worked on crits, it would mean you would get more risk-reward playstyle while still keeping a limit on the amount of ammo you can get in general.

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IMO, the game doesn’t need more RNG.

RNG keeps you from establishing a decent battleplan.

Further forces shade players to build crit, rather than power vs or other stats.

Further favours a set of weapons that are “the most prevalent picks [and thus shall be nerfed]”

Favours crit fishing.

Cooldownbased, with a %age of total ammo regenerated would make it equally useful for all melees, all ranged weapons and reduce some abuse, for example on bosses.


Although I still dislike artificial timers, I could see that working as well, 1 ammo per hit just is not enough for swiftbow and repeater crossbow so % of total ammo would help with that. What would you suggest for the %? 5%, 10%?

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Fixed generation values favour low ammo weapons. This is why they changed the WS passive ammo gen pre-WoM.

5% wouldn’t even mean a volley for the repeater (or 2.5 shots with the swiftbow)
But 10% would too be strong.

Question then reside in:
-Would you rather have a low cooldown and low ammo gen, forcing the player to actively engage into backstabbing?
-Or would you rather have a higher cooldown, in which case the player only needs to look out for a backstab once in a while?

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Yes, that is what I tried to address with my original post.
I prefer a shorter cooldown (read: none at all) with a lower chance of getting ammo (read: depending on crit chance).
As the pseudo random distribution for critical strikes alleviates the issue of crits being “too” random I think that making bloodfletcher dependant on crits would go nicely with the former of your 2 options.

why not go an extra mile and fine tune the number of ammo you get based on your loadout? Keep the timer, make it 1 arrow per 2 seconds for Hagbane just because of how oppresive it is. Make it like 1/2 arrows for long bow, 3-4 arrows for shortbow and volley or smth. Obv the numbers are scuffed, I don’t play elf, just the general idea.

Just get rid of bloodfletcher. Turn it into something more fitting for her role amongst the 3 elves. Just throwing a random idea off the top of my head like: Ranged attacks benefit from her backstab damage modifier, and or give her a 15% damage bonus for 10seconds.

Though mainly my point is that bloodfletcher steps on waystalkers toes and should be replaced with something else suitably thematic.


She needs a way to use her unique weapon. I would rather buff this talent and lock all other ranged weapon other than volley on her. It would be more thematic anyway.

Bloodfletcher steps in no way onto waystalkers turf
I can stay miles away from the action with ws
Shade requires getting down and dirty

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Or triggered by or also by headshots. Bloodfletcher is hard to see it’s triggered with backstabing anyways, imo.


How about the middle? 7% or 7.5%
Assuming that .5 is rounded up that would lead to
Hagbane 1/1
Longbow 1/2
Swiftbow 4/4
Repeater crossbow 3/3

The only difference being 20*0.075=1.5 for llongbow, which is rounded up to 2

Different/additional Idea:
Instead of a static 2 second CD, make it trigger on backstab headshots and backstab crits.
Would create synergy with her high crit chance/ult while overall reducing ammo gained by just standing behind a boss and mindlessly spamming leftclick
Backstab headshots are harder/impossible on certain enemies and require aim to activate the skill, but give an alternative to backstab critfishing

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My personal opinion is to sway away from effects on crits.

It makes crit building too important and occults other potential builds.

Unless the crit rate magically jumps to 50%, I’ll remain, not a fan…

Backstab headshots is not a good idea because every single rat (but the bigger one), is de facto immune (or almost)

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It would make a good build with the new cloak of mist with 4 seconds of guaranteed melee crit.
You want guaranteed ammo sustain? You can, but have to sacrifice boss damage (through ult) in turn.

Ammo sustainability via 2 or 3 Talents that synergize is justifiable unlike unlimited ammo via 1 talent IMO.

Rats not being backstab headshottable is alleviated by still getting ammo on backstab crit.

But I can see that a talent like this might overcomplicate stuff unneccesary.


Well, I kinda like the idea because of the lore.
I mean shade is more an assassin than an hybrid melee ranged as they are depicted in army books.

At release, she had this talent to fire while invisible. But now, she is a pure assassin.

I would love a build path toward volley and a mix gameplay.

I know there are too much ranged in the game already. But since she has to compete with ws, and has to work to get amo back. Why not. (Ofc lock bag away from her)

I can see the benefit of both short CD low percentage is more dangerous, so it should get more ammo overall. Vice versa higher CD should get overall less ammo as you ate less often in a dangerous situation.

In addition to my earlier posts suggestion of 7.5%/2s something like 20%/10s or 33%/20s?

What timeframe are you thinking of?
I tend more towards higher CD as backstabs can be wonky at times. But I think many would vote against it as it would further reduce total ammo gained (if you could continuosly backstab something)

Overall I agree, but in a pinch, having the ability to choose to take greater risk because you know you might need the ammo is more interesting from a game design standpoint.
Although it does open the door to potential abuses, I do not think a game should be balanced around the power players (this ain’t league of legends after all)

i agree, but I think that’s more on the weapon than her kit. I honestly think hagbane should be WS exclusive, but that isn’t gonna happen so I think the best way to go would be to just up the ammo count for her xbow a bunch and just keep bloodfletcher as a slow “little bit better sustain” talent if it needs to be around at all (I don’t think it does, for what that’s worth).

Elf already has very little choice when it comes to ranged weaponry…
Sure, they are all good, but cut the hag, and you leave HM with only 2 choices… And SB is a meme.

There’s already not much reason to run hag on HM, I doubt it would make much difference.
Her lacking other weapons and SB having balance issues is something separate entirely to the hagbane issue on shade and WS.

I used to run hag with extra ammo on HM back in the days…
HM lacks boss killing power, and hag filled that niche perfectly.

I agree that weapon balance is a complete other issue.
But leaving a weapon slot with 2 choices is not a good idea either.

In Game Design, there’s something called the Rule of 3.

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