It takes too long to get charges. By the time you have 1 or 2; The horde you killed to charge it is gone, leaving nothing to use it on. Which leads to Point #2
It does not HOLD CHARGE. It will, after being charged up killing an entire horde, lose it’s charge before the next horde.
Tying the wave to special attack is bad. By the time you do the animation, you’re either smacked out of the charge, or your team has killed any groups the wave would be effective on.
Suggestion:
Instead of making the wave a separate, too-slow-to-charge, too-fast-to-empty bar; Make it the Special Attack trigger at all times (Right now, doing Special Attack without charge does nothing).
Just base it’s damage off of Peril. But don’t have it quell peril.
This would encourage Psykers to build Peril with their staff/power of choice, switch to melee, send off a wave, and charge in.
This encourages Builds that boost the Psyker’s melee abilities off of Peril. Granted, the Psyker only has 3 passives, and ONE blessing on the Greatsword that scales off peril…But still.
I agree but I could definitely see them tweaking it in a future update if they see fit. I know the almighty @FatsharkStrawHat has been taking notes about any potential improvements to the update.
Its pretty powerful as it is (the scaling essence-charged wave). I would definitely look into the interactions in psyker’s tree more because I can routinely slay shotgunners and other scabs from just malefic + perfect timing + disrupt destiny and not full charge. If it were routinely pocketable and fast-charging you’d just see psykers wipe more stuff for near free like we already love the gameplay experience of being adjacent too. Because the max powered wave is nuts.
For my part, even just getting off a half charged wave before everything is dead often is a challenge (at least in the Damnation games I’ve played with it the last few nights), trying to get a max powered wave off with anything still left alive to engage (particularly that isn’t just chaff) is so difficult that I just resorted to popping the thing any time it hit the first charge point.
I agree that it sucks. It would have been simple to make it like the Relic Blade. But if they dropped the charge, made it scale with peril, i could serious get up and close with combos with both staff and GS. I would love to try that but yea i totally agree i have absolutely no reason to use it over the Dueling Sword which is by far faster, deadlier and easier to use. And you don’t have to worry about enemies magically turning off your special activation. I don’t understand why they made it that way. Very weird.
its 10 trash kills for a half charge and 20 for full so I find that really hard to believe. you’re probably like most psykers and not actually dilligently melee’ing. throwing like 6 sword swings between spells is not melee psyker. with the loadout I use I get that in about 4-5 swings if its pure groaners we’re dealing with, 5-7 if its poxies. and the half wave kills the trash. if you’re playing something without hi intensity I could see it maybe some of the time, but some of these abilities scale that way.
I agree with Molonious in that I think my only ‘problem’ with it is the fact it doesn’t hold charge at all. This SEVERELY hampers the weapon in terms of build variety, as it basically makes the weapon impossible to use outside of dedicated builds that use only it and nothing else.
This isn’t a bad thing per-say (the weapon still feels great and fun on the dedicated builds I’ve made for it) but I feel letting it hold it’s charge for the sake of allowing it to actually function as a ‘swap to’ tool would be nice.
To MD’s point though, perhaps holding a full charge would be a bit much/encroach on the original force swords used cases, so I’d posit that it decaying to a level 1 charge but still holding on the that indefinitely would be really nice. You’d still get the reward of the ‘BIG SLASH’ for using it as your main weapon, but if you wanted to offhand the thing you could still get some walker kills here and there and hold on to a ‘low charge’ to drop the small fry with when you need it before swapping back to your main killing tool (likely being a staff).
I feel this mostly a quality of life addition to, as in low tier damnation and under this weapon is basically just a sword with a stagger on it, as you’ll experience what OP is with any even moderately functional team where all the enemies are dead before the wave even barely gets to level 1. It thrives in Auric Damnation + content where the field is just full of guys and you can kill them all while also backstepping into a wave to kill the rest, but not everyone WANTS to do that and having the ability to play to both would be nice verses it strictly being a force weapon in high end content, while just being a greatsword everywhere else.
I just mentioned above how I picked up the weapon because of how well its moveset replicated HEMA longsword, sitting in back not swinging the sword wasn’t exactly the game plan here.
Was doing Damnation quickplay. I only had a couple places in multiple games where I really got to use the activated effectively at full charge (like holding off the rear horde as the team advances), most of the time when I’m sticking with the team I’d just be getting a full charge only to find a couple enemies still up or the battle shifted just enough to require a reposition and decay would kick in, so decided to just start popping it at half charge. On High Intensity that’s probably different, but that modifier didn’t show up in the cycle when playing, and I’m not sure it should be considered the standard around which to balance things since its a modifier and, as you noted, lots of stuff ramps up in power tremendously there in some insane ways.
Nah, the weapon is fine. The special attack shines on higher difficulties for sure due to longer engagements, higher number of specials/elites and general mob density. I would not under-estimate its stagger potential.
Unlike some other powered weapons, the force great sword is actually fairly balanced, thanks to rewarding good plays and positioning. I don’t want it to be turned into another vet power sword “I win” button spam, which trivialises everything.
Both force greatsword marks have really good movesets, and damage output. Some blessings are meh, but that’s true for many other weapons. The special is just a cherry on the top, and when you earn your chance to use it, it can make quite a difference. FGS slower attacks don’t synergise as well with the psyker talent tree as their smaller cousins and other finesse based weapons, but have some nice advantages, especially the horde control thanks to cleave.
The main issue I have with the sword is it feel like I am moving through sand when I sprint. I get the idea “two hand sword = heavy” but man it feels like slow motion lol. Other than that, I have enjoyed having a weapon that easily clears hordes. In terms of the special - it is very powerful so I don’t really see the argument of gaining it faster - maintaining it for longer, yes. You can literally delete an entire horde off the screen in a split second if used correctly.
I genuinely like it, though. I like both of the new swords the more I use them
Yeah sometimes I feel this and then other times it feels like it charges quickly. I don’t think I would be wrong claiming this weapon’s effectiveness is enemy density dependent and that the runs where it does feel always charged are the ones with a lot of roamers to fight between hordes.
Yeah I would not hate if it held the charges for a little bit, or decayed slower. Can definitely feel how fast it dissipates in the meatgrinder.
That… might have been the dev’s first choice. I know I shouldn’t be making assumptions like that, but it seems like a really obvious thing to do and the current mechanic was taken off of warpriest from Vermintide 2. And btw I hated it on Warpriest because he just wasn’t killy enough until WP got huge QOL buffs. I know I’m rambling, but it’s cuz I recognize the same criticisms I made about WP being repeated for Force Sword.
Force Sword is way killier, tho, WP couldn’t dream about 3-shotting chaos warriors the way force sword is doing to crushers. The only thing I think is standing in Force Sword’s way would be anyone with godtier horde clearing standing too close to psyker.
Also seems like sources of rending are phenomenal for the force wave, if that helps anyone.
I’m glad someone said it, all I could think while reading this topic was just “It’s funny because Fatshark already went through this with warrior priest’s passive.”
Even if they adjusted other numbers, I wouldn’t be against it lasting longer when not used, having a constantly draining bar that just feels like it’s trying to force you into using it is just annoying and unfun.
Yeah I think slower decay and/or longer delay before decay sets in is something everyone could agree on. I think it’s pretty sensible you can’t just hold a full charge special in your pocket indefinitely but they might have gone a bit far trying to prevent that.
It needs one permanent until usage bar (that’s worth of 2 bars as it has now) that fills with 6 chaff kills, 3 elite/spec kills or 1 mons kill. And it should gradually fill while hitting unyielding, not necessarily completing a kill.
Its deflector blessing is a bubble shield that prevents back shots and actually deflects the gun shots back to gunners with spread from front.
Lower peril build up.
Its first heavy is a fast stab like DS4.
It has 100% more cleave than it currently does.
Has at least 10% more attack speed, dodge speed, duration and sprint speed. And the dodge distance should be at worst -2.
Right now, it only looks cool and that’s why I’m trying it. As soon as the novelty is worn off, I’m back to DS4. It’s not a great sword.
Just came to add my voice and say I disagree vehemently. The sword, especially its special, scales on performance. If you’re doing your part and getting those kills it’ll charge more than fast enough. Its decay could be tweaked sure but even as it is, it’s more than good enough.
And idk the difficulty you play on but at least on T5+ there are so many enemies it makes no difference if the current horde / specials+ are dead or not, there will be more of everything a few seconds later anyway. The entire point of it is that it’s a nuke - tremendously powerful - and balanced around both that performance and the player’s ability to wait and prioritize right so they can put that special where it counts.
It’s a tactical weapon which rather than spammed needs forethought and planning. And personally this sword has raised my damage and overall offensive gameplay to a completely new level, even when it was already well & far above the average.
If they change the special to scale with peril only, or let you charge it with peril, then they would need to absolutely decimate its power to keep it balanced. This would completely destroy what makes it special, and turning it from a nuke into just another Illisi with slower & stronger swings but little else. If that’s what you want, why not just use that Illisi instead?
Gotta agree that overall the balance of power to spammability is excellent. Slower buildup but big payoff, great stuff.
Hence why personally regarding the special at least I only endorse decay changes, which mostly affect its performance on lower difficulties, not so much on higher ones.
Base cleave of the sword might also be a fair criticism. It is a greatsword, it should still feel like it without heavily investing into bonus cleave. Not convinced that’s really needed yet mind.
It’s funny that people say it under performs against the DS. Of course it does. Everything under performs against the DS because the DS is way over tuned. If your barometer for good is how other weapons stack up against DS then I’d argue that you’re not being very fair in your assessments.
Nothing will out perform DS right now. If top performance is all you care about, just keep using the DS and have fun with that.
