The forum is in read only mode and will be closing on March 1st 2017.

We are trying to streamline discussion and feedback through more modern channels.

Please provide feedback and discussions over on www.reddit.com/r/vermintide.

Thank you for your understanding.

The Fatshark Team
Options

Various suggestions for improvements

MeerkatMeerkat 13 PointsMember, Level1
edited January 23 in Suggestions
A bunch of suggestions to improve the game. Some of these may have been suggested before, but whatev. I will generally try to include an explanation of why alternative improvements may not be as good.

Salvaging

It is currently possible to accidentally salvage equipment you do not intend to salvage. Salvage confirmation dialogs have already been suggested, but honestly, that's not a very good method. Dialogs are clunky and add annoying additional steps to the processes that people will just start to ignore and auto-click through. A better method is to allow players to lock equipment. Locked equipment cannot be salvaged, fused or offered ( trait swapped ). Locking and unlocking equipment should be a two step process, what two steps I leave up to you.

Footsteps

Trash mobs currently do not have footstep sounds. How is this even a thing. Who thought silent trash mobs that spawn in directly behind players and can backstab was a good idea? Honestly. I've gotten much better about not eating backstabs from silent enemies, but that's not because I've gotten more skilled, it's because I've gotten more paranoid. It's because, "well, it's been ten seconds since the game last tried to fuck me, so I should probably check for backstabbing bullshit." Adding footstep sounds would greatly improve situational awareness, allowing players to better react to their current situation. And here's the thing. I get rats ( ratlings / halflings ) are supposed to be kinda quiet, but Kerillian literally states she can hear them skittering around. Plus, gameplay is paramount. The game should serve the mechanics.

No spawn radius

Trash mobs sometimes spawn in directly behind players. I've literally walked down completely cleared hallways, and then gotten backstabbed by a trash mob who spawned in behind me. I've also had Stormvermin patrols spawn in 10 ft. away from me. Nothing, then poof, an entire patrol. I've had packrats spawn in, and have gotten hooked immediately after their entrance sound effect ended. Enemies should not be able to spawn in within 8 m. of players. They may enter the map within 8 m. of players if they spawned elsewhere, and in the process of getting to the player, entered the map like on Ramparts where enemies have to scale the walls to get to the players ( but as they scale the walls, they should make noise ), but they should not be able to just poof into the map from random holes in the wall as long as a player is nearby.

Constant collisions

There are tons of locations on maps where players will get stuck on the terrain and other random bits of stupid clutter. For example, when approaching the third bell on Ramparts, players go up a bit of collapsed flooring or something, and there's a bit of a jagged break near the top that players can get stuck on. Sometimes, when you dodge, instead, you get stuck up on some random pebble, then you eat a Stormvermin hit, then get stun locked from having no stamina. This is frustrating and stupid. Have your QA guys search for misaligned map meshes or whatev, or take community suggestions and smooth all those things out.

Invulnerability on hit

Most similar games like Left 4 Dead and Payday, iirc, grant players a couple hundred milliseconds of invulnerability after taking a hit to prevent them from instantly succumbing to bad luck. I'm 90% certain this feature is not in this game, and I can't imagine why.

Rat lunge attack

The rat lunge attack is wonky as hell. It fucks up their hitbox causing them to sometimes slide under your attack hitbox meaning that you get to eat a hit you expected to interrupt. Other times, I've had the rat lunge attack clip through me, and for some dumb reason, the game then considers this a backstab. Or I'm backpedaling, and I think I see an opening for a counterattack and drop block only to instantly eat a hit because I failed to see the rat behind the five rats directly in front of me charging his lunge attack that just so happens to perfectly glide through his five buddies in front of him to hit me. Or the pebble that would normally completely stop me in my tracks will cause the rat lunge attack to path wonky as shit, cause him to make a weird, super fast semi-circle to avoid the obstacle, then slide in from and hit me from the side, bypassing my frontal block. In general, having enemy attacks track onto the player makes dodging feel inconsistent. Anyway, the rat lunge attack right now makes combat feel random and inconsistent. Honestly, if you can't fix the rat lunge attack, remove it.

Weapon swapping

It lags / occasionally doesn't work at all. Fix it.

A lot of the last suggestions deal with how random and wonky combat in this game can sometimes feel. Gameplay is the most important aspect of your game. Whether through incompetence or oversight, a lot of small issues combine to make the combat sometimes feel very inconsistent, and sometimes, just downright disgusting. A common hallmark of good games is that the player feels in control so when bad things happen to the player, the player feels that they were in fault, not that the game screwed them. See Dark Souls. If the player feels like they aren't performing optimally due to bad controls or netcode or mechanics... chances are that player probably isn't having that much fun cause when the game screws you, it is bullshit and not fun. Your game ( narrowly ) falls more into the second category than the first.

Weapon aesthetic customization

Allow players to apply aesthetics from a weapon they own or have owned to other weapons. This isn't a super high priority type request, but more options are always good. The primary reason I have made this recommendation is because exotic shields suck. They block like 40% of your screen ( pretty much the entire left side ), dramatically reducing situational awareness in a game that already does a terrible job of communicating information to players.

Offering

When offering ( swapping traits ), players should be able to lock one or two traits from being rerolled. Or change offering to roll only one trait at a time in the first place. In exchange, to preserve the effectiveness of these mechanics as currency sinks, increase the cost. Look, RNG systems are generally pretty shitty. They are almost always anti-player while almost never actually providing an actual benefit in return. RNG systems universally suck unless you consider forcing meaningless, menial grind a good gameplay mechanic. As a note, some might notice that I appear accepting of some RNG, which I am. The primary reason why I'm not recommending just doing away with RNG systems entirely is because I know 99% of devs would never consider such "blasphemy," as I'm fairly certain at this point game dev schools or whatev teach RNG as an essential element that will make their game AAA quality.

Comments

  • Halvars90Halvars90 56 PointsMember, Level3
    Salvaging - I absolute love that Idea that you should be able to lock items. When in the menu there should be a lock button on the weapon icon pressing that should make a box come "are you sure that you wish to lock this item" and the same for when unlocking. All locked weapons should be grayed out when using the forge.

    Footsteps - I think it can be a bit confusing with noises for everything in the game if every rat is going to make a step noise, what they have added is that there is a certain noise that comes when a rat is trying to stab you in the back. 100% sure it comes all of the time but it has definitely helped a bit.

    No spawn radius - some things they really should change, I've had a few specials that have spawned right in front of me from thin air.

    Offering - well RNG basically make games last longer since acquiring the stuff that you want is harder, but sometimes the RNG-system need's a little help since sometimes it is incredibly hard to get the stuff you need or want. I have still until this day only acquired ONE Glaive (the Christmas-gift does not count, a funny thing is that is the only way a buddy has received his).

    Locking a set if traits could definitely be useful, I used almost 300 orange to to try to get the traits I wanted (finally got it).
  • QuanrianQuanrian 117 PointsMember, Level4
    You're right about the noise, you can sort of hear them chatter a bit as soon as they come in. This may however blend in with other noises if you're not paying attention to it. This is however, louder and more distinct than footsteps would be. Also, those sneaky rats coming up from behind are literally there to check your awareness.
    Eat the game before it devours your life!
  • Jakal_of_Kazak_VlagJakal_of_Kazak_Vlag 158 PointsMember, Level4
    edited January 22
    Salvage: the salvage system works differently from the other forge tabs, in that you can't simply rightclick them into the window. get in the habit of rightclicking for the other tabs and you won't salvage things by accident unless you're really slow in the head.

    footsteps: you can already hear their raspy breathing, chittering curses and landing from leaps off of rooftops, but the fact their tiny padded feet aren't loud enough is the breaker for you? this one is on you, i only ever get it in the back when there's a fight going on and my team isn't watching my back like i watch theirs.

    spawning: this is already the case, but the game places their spawn, then calculates where it will move before spawning it. whne a rat instantly spawns and stabs you it's the lag at work.

    collisions: the ground is made out of objects, so it's fairly unavoidable.

    invuln on hit the game doesn't reward you for taking a weak hit to autosoak a heavy one, and i'm fine with that. get good, this game is designed to be punishing if you don't learn how to defend yourself.

    rat lunge like with the spawning, sounds like you have a connectivity problem.

    weapon swap: you're trying to swap and instantly use the thing you swapped. you need a moment to give the game time to switch. this isn't a bug, it's a feature to keep people from scripting a system that instantly swaps in melee and blocks before switching back to the last item.

    weapon customization: get bent, seeing what gear people have is important in pugs. the shield only blocks your line of sight when you're blocking, and you should only be blocking for more than a moment when you're defending your team, who will be minding your flanks if they're not useless.

    offering: this is actually impossible, the trait system is built that every weapon gets a trait set, which is read collectively. they'd have to rebuild the weapon trait system entirely for this, which is a lot of work. and fatshark doesn't have a great track record with rebuilding things, so i'd rather they left what works alone.
  • Halvars90Halvars90 56 PointsMember, Level3
    Jakal_of_Kazak_Vlag

    I do not know why you sound like an asshole... but you do... "slow in the head" WTF.

    Personally i just feel like a lock options would be fine because know you have to check the traits on each weapon before you salvage it so you don't accidentally take a weapon you want to keep. yes it says "new" the first time you look at, but if you scroll down you might "mark" it so the "new" vanishes. I thinks this is a convenience thing and not an high priority thing.

  • MeerkatMeerkat 13 PointsMember, Level1
    edited January 23

    Salvagespawning: this is already the case, but the game places their spawn, then calculates where it will move before spawning it. whne a rat instantly spawns and stabs you it's the lag at work.

    https://gfycat.com/GiftedBowedDassie

    Yup, lag.

    And with that, I think we can safely discount everything else you've said.

    Other games have done it better. It's okay if Vermintide learns from those games.

    Additionally, skippable cutscenes. Specifically referring to White Rat. Destiny had the same issue where cutscenes where initially unskippable.

    And the ability to accidentally dismantle equipment you did not intend to dismantle.

    Both issues were addressed in patches. Personally, I don't recall ever dismantling anything incorrectly on accident, but once the lock option was introduced, I don't think anybody ever considered it a bad idea.
    Halvars90 said:

    Footsteps - I think it can be a bit confusing with noises for everything in the game if every rat is going to make a step noise, what they have added is that there is a certain noise that comes when a rat is trying to stab you in the back. 100% sure it comes all of the time but it has definitely helped a bit

    Prioritize footsteps from enemies that have targeted you; if there are multiple enemies from the same or a similar direction, prioritize the single set that is closest ( as the greatest threat ) to simplify and reduce required channels. The sound effect on attack definitely does help, but it's like 0.3 s. warning. or whatev which only assists you in reacting to a threat but not prioritizing threats or planning responses. Sometimes, you're not in a great spot, but figure you can finish off a few guys in front because there are no threats in the rear, then you hear a single enemy to the rear as he attacks you ( 0.3 s warning ), and turn around to discover you've already been completely surrounded since the enemies are indeed silent.

    I do realize the rats will sometimes, occasionally, make a chattering sound that will give you warning much more early in advance, but again, that is a very sometimes, very occasional, very inconsistent thing.
  • Jakal_of_Kazak_VlagJakal_of_Kazak_Vlag 158 PointsMember, Level4
    Meerkat said:

    Salvagespawning: this is already the case, but the game places their spawn, then calculates where it will move before spawning it. whne a rat instantly spawns and stabs you it's the lag at work.

    https://gfycat.com/GiftedBowedDassie

    Yup, lag.
    exactly! the game set that spawn in while you were further back, and spawned the patrol in when you were turned away and the other two poor bastards hadn't turned the corner yet. the patrol needs to have a lock on spawning further away though, given its nature. sometimes this happens.
    Halvars90 said:

    Jakal_of_Kazak_Vlag

    I do not know why you sound like an asshole... but you do... "slow in the head" WTF.

    Personally i just feel like a lock options would be fine because know you have to check the traits on each weapon before you salvage it so you don't accidentally take a weapon you want to keep. yes it says "new" the first time you look at, but if you scroll down you might "mark" it so the "new" vanishes. I thinks this is a convenience thing and not an high priority thing.

    oh, that's an easy one. i am an asshole. worse, i'm an asshole that's usually right.

    and like i said, the current system can't "lock" a trait, because the traits aren't stored as seperate items. each set of traits (1, 2, or 3 depending on the quality of the item) is stored as a complete package, so the game system doesn't know how to seperate them. like if you go to the store and try to get a case of sodas where you want 9 colas and 3 lemon-lime, they can't help you there because the boxes only have a full set of an item. the traits are all in a box and the game doesn't have the ability to pull them open.

This discussion has been closed.